Asklemmy

Short answer: because doing a good thing for a bad reason - particularly when it establishes a bad legal precedent - is often a very bad thing in the long run.

I fucking detest TikTok for a variety of reasons (largely around the societal impact it has), but playing the national security card and then not applying it consistently (e.g. meta, twitter, insta, etc are not getting NEARLY the same level of scrutiny, despite very similar ways in which they influence society at both a national and global level) is a recipe for trouble, because that card can be (and often is) played for esoteric bullshit reasons. And I fully expect the incoming admin to use esoteric bullshit reasons for pretty much anything they possibly can.

People doing stupid challenges. People’s attention span getting lower and lower. People pretending they’re more popular than life itself because of their faux acting and lip-syncing

Sorry but this reeks of moral panic.

You shouldn't keep TikTok, it's trash, same as most social media. But this also shows why banning it is bad. It's not significantly different from any of the other brain-numbing, privacy-disrespecting trash out there.

It's not being targeted for the things that are wrong with it, it's targeted because it's a Chinese company. That's the problem with the ban.

I don't know if I'm about to say something that someone has already stated but there are a few reasons I'm aware of.

1. There is nothing preventing another platform from becoming another TikTok. All of the problematic users will just migrate to some other platform that probably has less moderation and continue doing everything they were doing before.

2. I've seen some concern about what it could do to the economy. A lot of content creators on TikTok were making money from it and some were successful enough to make a living. Some of these users have expressed that they were either unable to gain an audience on other major platforms or they were banned from them, making TikTok their only significant income source.

3. There are concerns about the hypocrisy of banning TikTok for spying on it's users when other platforms and services, like Facebook and Windows, do pretty much the same thing.

1. The legal framework and argumentation used to justify the ban is worrisome and can be applied overbroadly in the suppression of speech.

2. Despite this broad possible argumentation, it has just been, and will likely continue to be, wielded in a way targeted towards suppression of speech in a targeted, nationalistic, and at times overtly racist ways. (See: "Senator, I'm Singaporean, not Chinese.")

3. Like it or not, it's become a large repository of internet history and online conversation. The loss of the platform is the loss of that history.

If the government had particular problems with the platform's practices and behaviors, it would have been able to field an actual lawsuit with real charges, or levy fines. This "sell or be banned" is a clear grab for power more than any actual gesture towards protecting the people.

When Tik Tok gets banned they can and will ban other platforms (ex: Lemmy, Mastadon, Peertube, Matrix, Signal). They will also attempt to ban secure vpns (MullvadVPN) and "encurage" censorship on major platforms.

App plaforms contain propaganda but America wants to control the propaganda. TikTok shows what happens when America does not. Suddenly when presented with different viewpoints not allowed on American platforms, people change their opinion of America. See the censorship on Palestine on American platforms as an example.

For me it's not about TikTok. It's about using whatever flimsy, poorly worded law they will make to ban a platform I don't use to open the door for further bans and possible censorship in the future. A platform should be allowed to function if it can. If it's horribly made, or supremely unprofitable it'll find its own way out. I don't use it, I don't plan on ever using it, and honestly it doesn't affect my daily life outside of my mother in law thinking that some of the pallet crafts on there are worthwhile and me having to explain that they'll look good for a moment and then fall apart rather quickly.

It's the only way to stop my 65+ year old father from listening to it full blast while we're hanging out.

Look, TikTok is trash, but clearly the people championing this ban don't care at all about data privacy or social media manipulation. Ban none, or ban them all.

The one true way to resolve this issue (IMO) is to pass a digital bill of rights, regulating these social media corporations, and forcing them to make their products safe for all ages.

Banning one of many is pissing in the wind, and I don't enjoy urine in my face (no judgement if that's your thing, it's just not mine).

Monopolization of social media is a bad thing. The two remaining largest social media companies have both publicly begun supporting far right narratives. (Meta and X)

So what it comes down to is really the possibility that the TikTok algorithm gets controlled. But that's a distraction. SCOTUS already decided that corporations have first amendment rights. So even if TikTok is controlling it's algorithm in that way, it has the right to do so. Either that or Hobby Lobby has to pay for birth control for it's employees.

If you're worried about national security then these billionaires publicly turning their platforms into international political machines would be a problem too. But they clearly aren't a priority.

So what's left other than racism and protectionism? The law is also absolutely unconstitutional because it mentions TikTok by name and that's a big nono. The Constitution bans that and requires that all laws are enforced equally specifically because the ability to single out one entity with legislation is breathtakingly corrupt.

If you don't like TikTok that's fine. But you need to realize what this law is capable of. After banning TikTok by name they can also point the finger at any other social media company (and a couple other sectors) and simply declare them to be controlled by a foreign adversary. Even if it's wholly owned by US Citizens.

They gave themselves the power to force a fire sale and you all cheered because they said TikTok.

Because it's clearly being banned, not because of privacy violations, not because of the nefarious impact of a foreign government, but because of the content that is shared on it. It is the only major social media platform with a strong pro-Palestinian viewpoint on it. And the people in Congress have been caught on camera explicitly stating this is why they want to ban it.

I hate Tiktok. I don't use it. Never have. But I still don't want to see the US turn its internet into the Great Firewall of China 2.0.

The leaders in Congress cannot stand the idea of there being a social media platform that is popular in the US that isn't hosted in the US. Why? The answer is simple - control. All the US social media platforms are heavily influenced by the US government. Hell, most of them openly contract with the NSA. Facebook is an NSA contractor. These platforms get a ton of money from the US government. And despite what conservatives bitch at in regards to "being censored," the real censorship is against anything that doesn't advance US power and influence. Outside of Tiktok, the major platforms heavily censor pro-Palestinian messages and stories. Go to r/worldnews and post anything other than "Palestinians deserve to be vaporized," and you'll be banned within 5 minutes. It's literally that bad. Even when outright bans aren't in place, the platforms will severely down shift any pro-Palestinian content and keep it out of peoples' feeds.

"Beware of he would would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."

government bans social media because it makes it too easy to see the devastating results of wars that we profit off of

"Who cares about Tik Tok dances?!?!"

Because it's censorship by the goverment? also all the bad shit you mentioned can be easily found in most other social media too, should those be banned as well then?

Regardless of how we feel about TikTok (I dont like it either for the same reasons)

The ban isn't about privacy violations by the owning corporation or because of challenges or mental health, but rather that the US government (directly or by proxy through the owning corporation) isnt the one in control of the information collected or the algorithms.

Due to its younger user base and lack of US based corporate interests, things that US corporations would normally block, remove or downplay with their algorithms are allowed. This means the culture and information that would normally dissapear from US media and social media instead on tiktok tends to be much more liberal and available. On the other hand, information critical of china or contrary to their culture may be less visible, and your information is getting tracked by china instead of the us.

This difference was exemplified in the wake of the United Healthcare CEOs assasination. Traditional US media was extremely critical of the shooter, and dropped any presumption of Luigi's innocence or deniability prior to the conclusion of his court case. Comments and posts were removed for displaying anything other than giving him the death penalty (hyperbole, but). They denied that there was a problem and downplayed peoples concerns with the US healthcare system and billionaires.

TikTok on the other hand (and smaller social media sites like on the fediverse) showed immense support for Luigi, and expressed their disdain for the US healthcare system and the ruling class.

Same for the war in ukraine, especially for the genocide in gaza perpetrated by Israel on the Palestinians.

The government and ruling class is upset that they dont have the personal and tracking information of TikTok users, that they cant control the algorithm, and cant ask the company to stop showing things that make them look bad or could potentially be used to create a movement against them. Its those very trends that travel quickly through tiktok that have the potential to be dangerous to them.

I don't care about tik tok, I hate it. But its concerning how the government could just bypass the first amendment. They could ban Lemmy Instances next.

It matters whether the government can do things like this at all, because if they can do it to TikTok, they can do it to anyone and anything else. TikTok may or may not be a good platform, that doesn't matter at all.

A TikTok ban would consolidate more power into the hands of Mark Zuckerberg and Meta. Arguably, that's worse.

I enjoy tiktok (using Vanced) but I don't care if it goes away tomorrow. With that said, I don't like this ban as it sets a precedent where corporations can just ban the competition.

My TikTok feed is full of content that I find interesting and educational, from creators who work hard to make something valuable.

For them, banning TikTok means the work they put in to curating an audience will be partially lost, they'll retain only the followers who find them on another app. If they are monetizing, they'll potentially have to start over. That may discourage some who are just getting started from developing their craft.

If china, bytedance, meta, or any other platform is collecting user data in such a way as to be a national threat they definitely need to cut it out and this should be regulated. For example, it should be impossible to identify the location of military generals based on where their wives access TikTok from, or who's having an affair with who based on proximity to each other, or to develop a vast dataset of individually identifiable profiles of every user that could be used to selectively damage their character.

Aside from these problems, which are potentially solvable, I think the individual creator/maker economy is an awesome way to give more power to the people.

I don't use tiktok, I've never been interested in using tiktok, and if it was just going out of business or something then I would give precisely zero fuckaroos.

But I don't need the government making the decision to block it for me arbitrarily. I confess that I'm not studied up on the reasoning behind blocking it (I've mostly heard about security concerns), but if Congress and the supreme court actually cared about digital security, then they'd be passing a bill of digital rights right now. Instead of doing that, they're set on going after TikTok specifically, which tells us two things:

• Because they aren't passing blanket digital privacy rights, it's likely that TikTok is not the only company committing these privacy violations, but they don't want to punish the "wrong" company.
• Given the previous point, it follows that they don't actually care about digital privacy (duh), so the actual reason for banning them is likely something else. Other people in this thread have pointed out that the US government can't control propaganda on TikTok like they can other social media, but it could also be as simple as clearing the way for American competitors/lobbyists who stand to profit from the ban.

So yeah, like you I don't use tiktok so I'm not directly affected by the ban, I might've even supported it if it was due to an impartial bill of digital rights, but reasoning behind the actual ban is clearly bullshit on principle just by being so specific, and it sets a dangerous precedent. You saying that TikTok is shit so you don't care if it gets injustly and unconstitutionally banned is no different then saying that George Floyd was a criminal so you don't care if he was murdered by cops sans-due-process. You're being distracted, soulifix. Think about it, if the government cared about addressing the issues with TikTok that you brought up in your post, why are they going after TikTok specifically instead of addressing that behavior generally?

The only people who support the ban are boot licking idiots who don't know the real reason why it's being banned in the first place. The only reason TikTok is being banned is Marky Mark and Muskrat don't like competition to their own platforms. Platforms they are happy to censor for the US government's own devices. TikTok isn't doing anything other social media platforms are doing as far as data collection, they are just not based in the USA so Uncle Sam can't step in and demand the data. The whole thing is a production of hypocrisy and goose stepping politics.

It has its bads and a lot of the content is worthless trash, but it's also a really good way to see what's going on around the world from those people's perspectives. You see a lot of stuff that doesn't make it to Reddit or Twitter.

It's a lot harder to be against Ukraine when you can see the horrors minutes after a Russian strike.

The government hates it because they can't control it. They'd rather people only see what the mainstream media says, and not the fact everyone sympathizes with Luigi.

The free speech argument is genuine, despite how much I hate the shady practices of the platform.

there's also an economic problem with banning tiktok: tens of millions of americans rely on it as a source of income and its banning will effectively become the biggest layoff in american history and will have detrimental impacts to our already fraught economic situation.

I hate everything the US government does

Honestly you’re wrong. Tiktok has a lot of slop but it also has a lot of the front line reporting about social movements and crimes that Reddit thinks it has or maybe used to have.

they're banning tiktok because people there are denouncing the crimes of israel and, and the ties to the US gvt, and they can't force censorship like they can on US-based platforms, which are as bad, or even worse, in terms of data protection (since they keep selling & getting the data break which will inevitably end up in chinese hands anyway)

It's about your rights.

I want to decide if tik tok is a horrible thing that I don't want to use and then choose not to use it. I don't need the government telling me what is okay and not okay. I'm a grown up and can make that decision for myself.

Cheat sheet: look at all government policies and politicians this way. Regardless if you agree or disagree with the topic/results look at what idea or concept or precedence it sets forth and decide from there. (I personally hate tik tok for many reasons, both socio and political in nature and think it should be burned from he earth - but I don't support a ban on it) Second cheat sheet: if after that analysis you decide you support an idea, then ask how it gets paid for (whats the soirce of the financing) and who's in charge of it (how the money gets spent) and what checks and measures are in place to keep it productive (how it gets regulated).

I don't think tiktok is worse then any other large platform. All platforms have brain rot, all platforms have dumb challenges and all platforms do a lot of spying.

I'd hope this is just a freakout about someone else spying, but It feels like an excuse to start banning a whole bunch of stuff for flimsy reasons.

... and as for the spying itself, I would be far more worried about my local government getting that data then China. I don't live anywhere near China, what are going to do? Sell me stuff? like google does?

TikTok apparently pays creators significantly more than other apps.

It's one of the only platforms that doesn't actively suppress left wing views with its algorithm.

I'd be fine with EU style regulations on social media, or depending on how it's written, a more broader ban of social media in general. But banning tiktok only will do nothing to address the concerns you raised. Instead it just funnels people into social media ecosystems that greatly favor right wing sentiment and allow easy access for the 3 letter agencies.

It's about maintaining the ability to manufacturer consent. Tiktok presents a hurdle to that.

I know why it’s being banned or has been banned or whatever.

Maybe you don't. It is the only non zionist media platform in the US. The zionist offers to buy it are happy to not include the algorithm behind its success. Just to let them censor it. The ban did move forward during the Oct 7th and election cycle psyops, and Tiktok did not prevent voter suppression that gives Israel 4 years to implement its final solution.

It doesn't specifically have any strong/empire reason to be banned now. FB/Google/Musk donations to Trump are new reasons, that can enhance their properties.

If you actually knew all of this already, then you might not ask why it matters. Do you "know differently"?

All the reasons people cite for supporting the ban are problems with other social media platforms.

Also I think it's pretty dumb to support government censorship over cringe.

Tiktok has been useful for several groups that are normally extremely supressed with other algorithmic social media. Tiktok isn't geared towards the "what will make you angry therefore keep scrolling" or "what will make you buy more things" motivations that facebook et. al. are geared towards, so it will actually show you things you care about. It also has a tendency to show you opposing viewpoints from time to time, which makes it surprisingly useful for deprogramming people from misinformation.

For people with specific medical disorders or conditions, tiktok was excellent for finding others and sharing information. For people of different minorities that are normally supressed on social media, it was excellent for building community.

So sure, if all you watch on it was dancing teenagers, that's what you are gonna get: Vine 2.0. If you curate your feed a little then it'd help you branch out from your interests without the primary goal of keeping your eyes peeled to it or grabbing more ad revenue.

if you are part of a group that tiktok was basically the only social media network that had ever been helpful for, it's a big deal that it's going away. Its not about the format of the videos, but the algorithm and its focus on your interests rather than making money.

I imagine because a lot of people use it as a way to run their independent business now, TikTok accounted for $24 billion in gross GDP in 2023. Banning TikTok would be really disruptive to all the people who started using it to run a business, and while they will eventually find a new platform it will be disruptive for them in the short run https://newsroom.tiktok.com/en-us/tiktok-economic-impact-report-2024-smb

Another reason is that it's relatively unfiltered stream of information where people can discuss issues like the genocide in Palestine that are censored on US owned platforms. If you don't see why that's important I don't know what else to tell you.