Ask Lemmy

Btw I now understand the hate towards manual cars. Automatic should be the only option

This is a big problem with people these days. You admitted you suck at driving, you're just barely learning how to do it, but you think you're qualified to mandate what is available to everyone else? You do not have enough experience to have an opinion that affects other people. Stick shift is completely intuitive when you know how to do it.

It definitely gets easier in my experience. A lot of the things that take conscious effort right now are going to become reflexes and automatisms with more experience. Right now you are building that experience, and there isn't really a way to speed it up. You just need to do each action dozens and hundreds of times, until you do it without thinking.

Driving a manual car, for example, is definitely more complex than an automatic one. You literally need to manage one more thing. But do not worry about it, you will change gears a lot during your practice sessions and build a lot of experience quickly. In a few months you will probably not think much about gears, and in a few years you will be managing them without giving it a single thought.

Fun anecdote, I recently got a new car and it is an automatic one while I previously only drove manuals. For a few days I couldn't figure out how to start smoothly, and I was very confused... until I realized that starting mostly involved the clutch on my previous car. The first movements of my right foot used to be to keep the rpm under control while disengaging the clutch, which is just not needed on an automatic car. I was simply applying the same muscle memory to the new car without realizing it!

being too soft or too rough on the clutch is a matter of millimeters is ridiculous

On this point specifically, don't think of it as millimetres of distance. You act based on how the car responds, not trying to hit a specific distance of pedal movement. You already do the same thing with your other foot - you don't think "I need to press the accelerator down 55 mm", you just press it a bit more or a bit less until the car is going the speed you want it to go at. Same deal with the clutch, there just isn't a dial on the dashboard that tells you where you currently have it.

You're right that driving involves processing a lot of information at once that nobody is particularly familiar with absorbing when they start. It is difficult and dangerous. That's why there are tests and licences. But in much the same way that typing was once completely alien to you and is now something you do with little active thought, you'll get there soon enough with the clutch too. And if you learn it now, you'll never be caught out in a situation when there isn't an automatic option available

Skill issue

Manual transmissions are operated almost entirely by "feel". Once that sinks in, it's a lot easier.

If you can, go find a quiet street, parking lot, or any place with an incline. Practice stopping in the middle of the incline and taking off without stalling. Don't stress out when you inevitably stall. You will and that's ok. If you can master starting on a hill, you'll find that the rest of it comes a lot easier.

With the transmision in 1st and your foot on the brake, release the clutch very slowly until the engine starts dragging just a little. Slowly take your foot off the brake. You'll know the clutch is in the right spot if it keeps you from rolling backwards. At that point, start to accelerate and let the clutch out slowly. Continue to accelerate and up the hill you go.

Don't hesitate to hit the brakes at any time if you feel like you're going to roll backwards. Better to stall than to roll back into someone behind you. Depending on the gearing, you may be able to start in 2nd and that will keep you from having to worry about shifting in the middle of the hill.

Don't panic. Learning is good. If someone gets upset with you because you're inexperienced and stall out then screw them. They should try to remember what it was like to learn how to drive. It just takes practice, practice, and more practice.

With enough practice, driving becomes second nature to the point that you don't really think about it. This goes triple for manual transmission cars because you have so much control over the behaviour of the vehicle that it almost feels.like.an extension of yourself. The learning curve is a pain but the payoff is worth it.

It becomes easy with practice, and driving a manual is not distracting at all once you get the hang of it

Your trouble with the clutch and watching the road, that will definitely get easier with practice.

But what always remains stressful is that lots of drivers are insane cunts. As in, they should be in a psychiatry. They'll tailgate you, if you have the audacity to drive the speed limit.

And well, other factors can be at play. I've probably got some flavor of autism, so having everything around me rattle and explode, and needing to constantly pay attention to the road, that stresses me out due to sensory overload. Even after multiple years of practice, I'm more than glad to walk to the shops.

You need seat time. You'll get better the more you do it, until driving is instinctual. Avoiding doing it is how you don't learn.

Driving and shifting becomes second nature. It's not something you think about. It's like walking. You don't think left foot, right foot, left foot... Uh oh was i at left or right?

I learned to drive using a manual transmission vehicle. I spent a lot of time in empty parking lots, then in empty subdivision roads. It sucked, and having my dad as a teacher made things worse (he had a bit of a temper). As you stated, learning the clutch friction point for your vehicle is crucial (and it's different in every model of car, so that's fun), but once you get that down, the rest falls into place pretty easily.
I have had 4 vehicles since I got my license, and only the most recent one is automatic. I much prefer driving manual, but they're getting increasingly difficult to find outside of sports cars.

I love manual driving! Sure it didn't go super smooth when I first started, but after 2 years, I don't even realize I'm shifting automatically. But it might be me that I want to have control over my car, rather than it driving for me.

Mate, you have zero experience how to drive but feel the need to tell others what is save and what not?

Can people please shut up talking about topics they know nothing about?!

It definitely gets easier after muscle memory kicks in. Doesn't really make a difference if manual or automatic.

Dunno what the laws are like where you live but might be worth doing some lessons with a friend on quieter country roads to get more practice with the clutch if possible.

At the risk of sounding negative - if driving a car is too hard for you, maybe you shouldn't. You're going to be piloting a 4000 pound boulder down the road. Would you really be okay killing someone by accident?

We live in an age of Ubers & Lyfts. Taxis have never been cheaper nor more convenient. Being car free is totally possible.

Regardless, I would still encourage you to finish your studies and get your driver's license, if only because it's the one form of ID every adult is expected to have.

Hello, driving enthusiast here.
Driving was stressful for me to learn as well. But i picked it up pretty quick. I learned in an auto and learned manual later which took some practice.

This all being said, like anything else, you are only finding manuals distracting because you're still learning and they aren't second nature. once you don't have to think about driving a manual it won't be distracting. automatics are the distraction problem, imo, because they allow drivers to play on their phone instead of driving.

I've only ever fallen asleep while driving an automatic (twice), never a manual.

You are frustrated while you are learning and that's to be expected but don't you dare go blaming your problems on others, such as cyclists. Being a poor, distracted, and terrible driver is your fault and your problem. If you can't handle driving around other people then stop driving.

FUCK NO. I hated driving lessons, but I love driving ever since I got my license. It took me almost a decade to figure out why. First, I hate other people telling me where to go. GPS, no problem, but Kevin over here telling me to take a left 1 second before I'm past the intersection iterates me so much. I can't concentrate on signs or the road if I have to constantly anticipate so arbitrary direction.

Also, not driving my own car makes me anxious. It feels like the car is 2 ft wider on the outside but more cramped on the inside. My field of view narrows, and I get clumsy on the clutch. All because my brain is on a constant loop of 'this isn't mine, don't wreck it, this isn't mine, don't wreck it'.

Driving isn't stressful, doing it by the book is. On the road you just go with the flow. If you turn the wrong way into a one way street, you wave, say sorry and back out again. If you take somebodies right of way and nothing bad happened then you just move on. Its not like the police is waiting around every corner. Driving lessons hold you to a way higher standard then most people adhere to on the road.

I've been driving for well over a decade, nearing two. I hate every minute of it. Honestly, I hate other drivers more than driving itself. Trust no one, assume everyone is out to kill you because half of them are.

The most important skill for driving is learning to observe your surroundings calmly, but alertly. The things you mentioned as distractions are the things you need to be paying attention to because those are the things you must navigate around.

It's easy to get worked up about all the things demanding your attention. A lot can go wrong while driving, from road hazards, to accidents, to traffic, to mechanical problems with your vehicle. My advice, take it at your own pace. It's a speed limit, not a speed requirement. Highways and some types of special roads have minimum speeds, but the worst that happens if you drive slow enough to feel comfortable behind the wheel is some asshole who is in a hurry is grumpy.

It just takes time and practice, just relax and keep your eyes on the road.

As with most things, it gets easier with practice. After enough practice, you'll find many of the actions and reactions of driving will become habits you do automatically. Which is one of the reasons it's a good idea to practice good habits now, as practice makes permanent. Take your time, and try to be predictable to other drivers (use your signals, don't make radical maneuvers). And don't let the assholes who think the horn is an "I'm annoyed at you" button get to you. Fuck them and the camel that came on them. Take your time and make sure you are driving your car in a way you can control.

As for learning on a manual, yes that increases the difficulty. Depending on the specific vehicle, it can make it easier or harder. Some clutches will let you get away with murder, others will murder you for being less than perfect. Many years ago, my brother owned a car with a clutch that was just brutal. It would go from "not engaging" to "fully engaged" within the slightest movement. My truck, on the other hand, the clutch was so forgiving, you damn near couldn't stall it. Thankfully, I learned to drive a stick on my truck and when I tried my brother's car, it took a lot less time to get used to it. As above, take your time and it will come to you with practice.

It starts out feeling like you're driving a two-tonne weapon in a world full of drunk people driving two-tonne weapons. You're nervous and hypervigilant.

After a while your driving instincts develop and becomes less of a problem. And on days when the sun is shining and your favourite song is playing, it begins to seem like driving isn't so bad after all.

It gets easier with practice, I don't know about where you live but in Portugal to get your license you can only learn manual and you have to do ~~40~~ 32 hours of driving lessons before the exam. By the end of the lessons it becomes second nature. We practiced a lot starting and parking in steep climbs and even rolling starting the car as if the battery was dead. But this was my experience, it changes from school to school.

Since here the majority of cars are still manual, I believe we should learn them because its much easier to move to automatic than the other way around.

As someone who drives an automatic, I so wish I could have a manual. I much prefer driving them.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m really glad I was able to drive an automatic and get experience first, but once you start really driving a car, you realize how much an automatic limits you. Things like engine braking, coasting, and honestly just staying in one consistent gear when you’re trying to maintain good speed control are much harder, if not next to impossible depending on the automatic.

Learning to drive is going to take a lot of time though, and the fact that everyone just does it and takes it for granted I think really messes with you. Speaking from experience, most people don’t even learn to drive that well, no matter how much they drive. I see people constantly driving off the lines, poor speed control, braking distance, etc. just blows my mind that where I live (USA) there’s next to no requirements to drive.

Yeah, I did driving lessons once and realised it was too late for me to start learning driving.
So I decided to be the stupid people with their bicycle and I'm much happier.

I feel much more in control when I am the motor and tend to get much better reaction times. On top of that, the lack of vision blocking, making it easier on my low situational awareness.

It's way cheaper too.

I sometimes wish I still had a manual transmission for more interaction in the driving experience, but they’ve been difficult to find here for the last couple decades. I did finally give up as I realized manual transmissions are no longer relevant for newer car technologies.

However to add to everyone’s comments about time and practice …. I have two teens who recently got their driving licenses. Both were technically fine but inexperienced and nervous after they got their licenses. However one has been driving to school every day for the last year, and already drives like any adult. A drivers license s just the beginning of learning to drive with you as the sole person responsible. It may seem overwhelming but you can gain confidence and experience faster than you expect. Just keep at it, do your best, learn from mistakes (as in do better, dont just criticize yourself)

It really depends. You need to train yourself to focus on the important stuff and let the rest become second nature.

Driving a manual car usually doesn't take conscious effort to do, you just.. drive. But that takes practice. Lots of it.

And some people just never get there. Or they are afraid to drive, which tends to provoke dangerous situations. Or they can drive okay but don't pay enough attention to the road.

But usually driving with an instructor is stressful, once you get your license everything will be more relaxed and easier.

Where do you live that you HAVE to learn manual? Here in Germany you have a choice of either learning manual or automatic. If you learn automatic though you are only allowed to drive automatic cars and if you learn manual you are allowed to drive both.

When I first started driving, it was with manual. And it really helped once I realized two things:

• Being shitty at gear shifts won't make me fail at the final test. Instructor told me as much. If I wear out the clutch and cox up the engine through repeated stalls, that's my problem - I can torture and destroy my car through ineptitude, as long as it's done in accordance with road safety.
• Getting used to the clutch is half the battle. Not clutches in general, but the specific one you're driving. Once you get used to know how insensitive or sensitive it is, the rest will be a lot easier. With time (and not a whole lot of it, actually), you'll be shifting gear without having to think much about it, just like the rest; right now you're struggling with you many areas that require your focus. As you practice them, you will do all of them without thinking about them.

I still need a while getting used to new gearboxes whenever I'm using someone else's car.

Oh, and a tip: be sure to memorize the gear positions, and while standing still with the engine off you can practice shifting from and to any gear without looking. That's one less thing to pay attention to.

It scared the hell out of me too, but soon it'll be just like walking. When you were first learning to walk, you fell down a lot, and although most of us don't remember it, you were probably reluctant to try again after falling. But you kept trying and it became second nature. Keep practicing and soon you'll be singing along with the radio, eating a burrito and sending texts while merging across 6 lanes of traffic without even thinking about it.

Ok, maybe don't do ALL those things. Just stick with it!

I don't have much experience with manual, but I do have severe ADHD. From my experience, it takes about 6 months of driving every day before your brain does most of it automatically. It is really awful at first having to constantly think about every step. Couple random anecdotes that may help. My assumption is you are driving on the right:

1. Drive barefoot or with minimalist shoes. You can really feel the car and road this way. Flip flops are a no no. All it took was them getting caught in the pedal once to never do it again.
2. Leave lots of space in front of you in high traffic situations. If you are sitting in the far right/exit/slow lane a lot it will help other drivers get around you. If it is a mulilane highway, it may be safer to stay in the middle lane until it is time to exit.
3. Look left first. Oncoming traffic hitting your driver side door is bad.
4. If you ever ever doubt when looking both ways, just look again. People can wait.
5. People get mad or do stupid shit. It is ok. We stop being rational people once "time" enters the equation. At some point, getting mad at other drivers all the time makes you a worse driver. Learn to just let shit go.
6. Try to space yourself where you don't create blindspots for yourself or others.
7. Position your side mirrors properly. If you can easily see you car door, they are pointing in too far.

Adjust your seat and steering wheel. You want the steering wheel far away from your face. If you have an adjustable steering wheel, this will be a lot easier. There is a little lever you can pull to unlock it.

1. Unlatch the wheel and push it completely away from you.
2. Adjust your seat first so you can reach the pedals and feel in control of run. Test how it feels to push the brake, clutch, etc.
3. Now, adjust the steering wheel. Put your arms straight out. You want your wrists to touch the "10&2" position of the wheel.
4. Keep the steering wheel as low as you can, but still see the instruments, and make sure there is plenty of space between you and the very deadly airbag. You do not want it hitting your face and it needs enough space to deploy to properly protect you
5. Make final adjustments as needed and recheck your mirrors.

I really didn't like driving when I first started taking lessons and even after I got my license and a car ( I never started driving until I was 30) but eventually I got much more comfortable with it . Now I deliver newspaper and Amazon packages as a side gig .

Think of your favorite video game or hobby, do you have to remember each movement and action? Driving is like that, eventually it's just an extension of your ability to move about.

It gets easy, manual is better because I'm more focused on everything. It doesn't take that long to learn.

"Are cars always this awful" you ask, whilst shitting on the alternative...

A good way to learn the friction point of a clutch is to find some flat ground (somewhere you can practice and not worry about traffic or pedestrians) and come to a complete stop.

Put the car into first gear and without touching the accelerator or brake, very, very slowly bring the clutch pedal up. You'll feel the engine begin to bog down the further the pedal comes off the floor. Push the clutch back down and repeat until you feel comfortable with where the clutch is "catching".

Once you can reliably find this spot in the clutch pedal's travel, begin adding in some throttle to help you take off a little quicker.

I've taught others to drive manual and this is a good way to build the muscle memory that helps when driving on the road so you don't have to think about it.

Maybe that helps but either way good luck on your journey!

You're just learning.

You should always be paying attention, and vigilant. But over time you don't actively think about keeping the car between the lines, you just do it. You don't think about accelerating a bit to maintain speed when a hill starts, you just do it. Etc etc. Same with driving a manual transmission. At first it's all so much. Pat your head and rub your belly. But eventually it becomes a learned skill you don't actively focus on.

No, it's not awful all the time. Cruising down a highway or familiar streets can be kind of zen. I say this as someone who despises car-culture and believes most transit should be mass, public, transit options like buses and trains. But I have fond memories of cruising down the highway at night by myself singing along with my favorite music.

I live somewhere that's walkable and has a subway system now, and it's much better. Don't have to worry about parking, insurance, fuel, drinking too much. So if you really hate driving, you could look into living somewhere that doesn't require it.

When I first started driving I was terrified all the time, but over time fear disappeared. It gets easier with experience.

You’re right. You should give up driving.