this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2023
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[–] [email protected] 131 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (9 children)

TL;DR: Due to being smaller and lighter, electric bikes and mopeds require significantly less energy to move themselves around than an electric car. The article starts with a headline about "oil demand" but then spends much of the rest of its length harping on consumer monetary costs instead. I could have said that in a lot fewer words. Actually, I just did.

Also, in SE Asia and other places where the primary mode of transport is a small motorbike, as it happens these small motorbikes actually pollute a lot for their displacement due to having basic uncomplicated engines, often not running very well, and lousy or absent emissions controls. ICE vehicles are also at their worst fuel consumption/distance traveled ratio when they're idling or crawling around urban areas at low speed. Replacing these with electric versions just makes sense.

Full disclosure: I own a gas guzzling truck, a fuel efficient car, seven motorcycles, and an electric bicycle. I use different tools for different jobs, as appropriate. If you're looking for a magic bullet, you will probably need it in a few different calibers.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 11 months ago (3 children)

I need to kill an elephant. What should I drive?

[–] [email protected] 66 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Your ancestors hunted the mammoth on foot with a rock tied to a stick. Use that.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 11 months ago (4 children)

Yeah but they’re all dead, what does that say about their tactics?

[–] [email protected] 38 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I mean, they hunted mammoths to extinction so, pretty fucking effective lol

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago (4 children)

I mean, we're here, which means someone must have killed a mammoth.

But really they didn't hunt them with rocks on sticks. They chased them toward a cliff with their friends waiting at the bottom to dispatch any that survived the fall. This is why there's no more mammoths.

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 11 months ago

If you're looking for a magic bullet, you will probably need it in a few different calibers.

That's a clever way to put it and I like it

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Out of your seven motorcycles, which one is used for which purpose?

[–] [email protected] 33 points 11 months ago (10 children)

I'll bet you weren't expecting to get an actual answer to this, but I'm going to give you one. (Spoiler: None of them are a Harley.)

First, I do use all of my bikes for commuting (the electric bicycle often, too, when the fancy strikes me) and usually ride a different one each day. They all get better mileage than my car and certainly better than my truck.

KLR650: Long distance touring and adventure rides, motocamping, hauling comically large objects that should not be transported by motorcycle.

Bashan BSR-250/Enforcer: I ostensibly bought this for my nephew to ride on adventure trips with me, but I also use it for tooling around town, light duty shopping, etc.

Honda VT750C/Shadow A.C.E.: Two up riding and touring, also good for making lots of obnoxious noise. My wife likes the passenger seat and sissy bar. Goes faster than the Vanvan, even with two people on it for long trips.

Yamha FZ6R: Dicking around on twisty roads. Irritating Tesla/M3/AMG/Corvette owners.

Orion/Nicot RXB250L: Playing in the dirt, at the motocross track, off road, doing wheelies, and narrow technical trails I probably shouldn't try to manhandle the KLR down.

Honda CH50/Metropolitan: In town errands, shopping trips. It achieves ludicrous fuel economy and you can fit a lot of stuff under the seat. My wife rides this one more than I do.

Suzuki RV200/Vanvan: Bought for my wife to learn how to ride a "real" motorcycle, i.e. with a clutch and gears. She uses it for motocamping trips.

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[–] [email protected] 85 points 11 months ago (2 children)

This article is vastly understating the potential benefits of e-bikes. Like-for-like replacements for car trips are only the tip of the iceberg; the real benefit of e-bikes is that the more people that use them, the less car parking we need. That means we can put back all those buildings we destroyed when we razed our cities for the car.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Fuck more buildings....make parking lots into parks and green spaces

[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago

Why not both? More housing and more parks. Win win.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 11 months ago (7 children)

Don't forget you can ride a mile or two to the train station and get around like that.

Even if you have a bike in town and one at home. Two bikes are cheaper than 1 car and more space efficient.

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[–] [email protected] 61 points 11 months ago (5 children)

I did the math once for my own commute, on my e-bike and with my electric car, and found that while the electric car uses only 20% of the energy that an average gas-powered car would, the bike uses just 1%. My bike, on my route (both directions averaged together) got 2,200 mpge.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Miles per gallon energy? What's that abbreviation?

[–] [email protected] 35 points 11 months ago (8 children)

Just another example of how Americans will use anything but metric (we do use metric sometimes, I know, it’s just a meme). We could easily measure it in Wh/km, but then we would also have to change how we measure gasoline cars if we want people to make direct comparisons. But, since we sell gas by the gallon, we would also have to change how gas is sold. When the EPA first came up with mpge I thought it was stupid (we don’t buy electricity by the gallon!), but I’ve come around to the convenience of being able to easily compare the two types of fuel. The EPA assumes 1 gallon of gas to contain 33.7 kWh of energy.

Maybe we should get everyone to switch to Joules for measuring, buying, and selling gasoline and electricity?

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The E is for Equivalent. It's how "fuel" efficiency is discussed when referring to non liquid fuel vehicles.

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[–] [email protected] 55 points 11 months ago (11 children)

My only problem with ebikes is there's no chance in hell I'm consistently driving on the road with cars.

With how convenient these are, I hope there's more push to add protected bike lanes in road heavy places to increase adoption.

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[–] [email protected] 42 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Whaaaaat? You mean electric last-mile micromobility cuts down on emissions in a significant way, just like people had been saying for years? Who would have thought?

[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Car-brain finds small electric vehicles are more efficient, in shocking study.

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[–] [email protected] 40 points 11 months ago (4 children)

When I was younger and more invincible around 2005, I bought one of these crappy Ebay engine kits for a bicycle. One thing I noticed is that it wasn't really any slower from home to work than a car, because I could go around traffic. An E-bike would have been great. A lot of them get around on 500 watt or 750 watt motors, which is considerably smaller than an electric car's motor.

I'd have one now, but it's hard to ride one when I have to carry a kid with me most places.

[–] [email protected] 50 points 11 months ago (20 children)

I’d have one now, but it’s hard to ride one when I have to carry a kid with me most places.

I got an e-bike because I needed to carry a kid (actually, two) around with me. FYI, cargo bikes are a thing:

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (3 children)

It’s fun how the preview image for the article has two kids being carried around. But I can understand if you don’t see that as safe in your area, etc.

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (3 children)

Goddamn I love my ebike. It’s still very much a bike, but it changes the equation. I can ride a nice big heavy comfortable cruising frame, pull my kid in a trailer bike, get up steep hills that would otherwise stop me, and go 4x as far before I’m tired. It is just a total game changer. I’ve rediscovered the joy of riding my bike like I haven’t known it since college. I’m older and creakier than ever but my bike enjoyment hasn’t diminished - it has increased.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 11 months ago (1 children)

First and foremost, people can afford them.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Second, they are more fun and you get to avoid all the traffic.

Third, cheap to run, no need to pay insurance, taxes, parking.

Fourth, anyone can ride it even children, no drivers license needed.

And so on...

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (6 children)

Great. All technologies that bring down CO2 emissions are needed.

As long as people get rid of their dino juice cars, who cares.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (4 children)

Oh really? Maybe not moving 2,5 tons of metal and battery isnt a good idea? Maybe bikes were always a better mode of transport? I have a feeling that this was pretty obvious.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Watched a YouTube about electric vs gas scooters in Taiwan 🇹🇼. Apparently it's like 6 scooters for every 10 people, crazy!

But the uptake of electric scooters wasn't as much as they thought, but a lot of complaints were around "cost", "parking" and "weight"

Sounds like an electric bicycle would solve all those issues over an electric scooter 🛵

Especially for the poorer, high 2 wheel usage nations, like Vietnam or India.

Just have to pedal a bit! 😉

[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago (10 children)

I have heard this for years now. This all fine. I also have an E-Bike. I really love using it. But I live in central Europe. Weather is really shitty here from October-March. I use my car then. And no, clothing for biking in bad weather is not an option for me. I really can't be bothered to change clothes on my job. I just won't do that.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago (6 children)

I think big cars and SUV should be banned.everyone should use a moped or a bike but 9-5s pretending to be rich will hate it.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Love to see this!

On a related note: Feel free to stop by [email protected]

[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

This reads like an advertisement. Not saying it is. But it does.

Edit: Oh, AAP (Australian Associated Press)! Then it's definitely an advertisement.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Ebikes need secure destination parking or they lose usefulness

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (31 children)

these are feasible in cities that you wouldn't want to drive a car in anyways. probably not so good for commuting around Boise Idaho

[–] [email protected] 22 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Boise is a college down that is VERY bike friendly. Nearly 200miles of bike lanes and trails.

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