this post was submitted on 09 Nov 2024
216 points (95.0% liked)

Europe

1509 readers
417 users here now

News and information from Europe ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡บ

(Current banner: La Mancha, Spain. Feel free to post submissions for banner images.)

Rules (2024-08-30)

  1. This is an English-language community. Comments should be in English. Posts can link to non-English news sources when providing a full-text translation in the post description. Automated translations are fine, as long as they don't overly distort the content.
  2. No links to misinformation or commercial advertising. When you post outdated/historic articles, add the year of publication to the post title. Infographics must include a source and a year of creation; if possible, also provide a link to the source.
  3. Be kind to each other, and argue in good faith. Don't post direct insults nor disrespectful and condescending comments. Don't troll nor incite hatred. Don't look for novel argumentation strategies at Wikipedia's List of fallacies.
  4. No bigotry, sexism, racism, antisemitism, dehumanization of minorities, or glorification of National Socialism.
  5. Be the signal, not the noise: Strive to post insightful comments. Add "/s" when you're being sarcastic (and don't use it to break rule no. 3).
  6. If you link to paywalled information, please provide also a link to a freely available archived version. Alternatively, try to find a different source.
  7. Light-hearted content, memes, and posts about your European everyday belong in [email protected]. (They're cool, you should subscribe there too!)
  8. Don't evade bans. If we notice ban evasion, that will result in a permanent ban for all the accounts we can associate with you.
  9. No posts linking to speculative reporting about ongoing events with unclear backgrounds. Please wait at least 12 hours. (E.g., do not post breathless reporting on an ongoing terror attack.)

(This list may get expanded when necessary.)

We will use some leeway to decide whether to remove a comment.

If need be, there are also bans: 3 days for lighter offenses, 14 days for bigger offenses, and permanent bans for people who don't show any willingness to participate productively. If we think the ban reason is obvious, we may not specifically write to you.

If you want to protest a removal or ban, feel free to write privately to the mods: @[email protected], @[email protected], or @[email protected].

founded 4 months ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[โ€“] [email protected] 27 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Trump has long shared his disdain for NATO โ€“ during his first term, he reportedly privately discussed pulling out of the alliance completely.

Which would at this point not be unwelcomed.

[โ€“] [email protected] 16 points 6 days ago (3 children)

It wouldn't be fantastic, the UK and France can't project the same kind of power the US does.

[โ€“] [email protected] 35 points 6 days ago (2 children)

Well, true.

But on the other hand, sanity from not being beholden to a demented child-raping fascist is a big bonus.

[โ€“] [email protected] 6 points 6 days ago

*alleged demented, *allegedly child-raping ...

[โ€“] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago

It's not like the us would be out of Europe's lives though, it would be even more obnoxious as there wouldn't be any shared standards any more

[โ€“] [email protected] 11 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Is the US power projection at the long term benefit of the EU though? The consistent destabilization of the Middle East for instance brought more tension to Europe as people had to flee from the region. EU member states getting dragged into US wars didn't help our image in the world either.

When it comes to defense, UK and France have enough nukes for effective deterrent. The EU is also large enough to thwart aggression at its borders and buffer zones like countering the Russian invasion of Ukraine, if the EU chooses to develop and maintain a joint defense infrastructure. Unfortunately that was postponed instead of forwarded after Biden won in 2020 and EU politicians went back to the status quo.

[โ€“] [email protected] 5 points 6 days ago

Yep, destabilization of Middle East is a big win for the enabler US against EU - they get influence and oil, EU gets migrant waves to deal with.

[โ€“] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago (1 children)

"Power projection" isn't necessary for a strictly defensive alliance.
The fact that a direct attack on one member counts as a direct attack on all members (some of which have nukes) is enough.

[โ€“] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Unless you're going to nuke an invading force then many of the smaller or less well equipped NATO member nations are going to rely on the power projection capabilities of the bigger militaries in the alliance, right?