this post was submitted on 30 Aug 2023
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[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (3 children)

But many states still allow people to get reduced sentences via the gay panic defense for killing LGBTQ people.

You say that like it's explicitly allowed by the state. It isn't. It's a legal defense lawyers use in court. Whether or not it's legitimate is determined by a jury.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

gAy PaNiC is never legitimate.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Tell that to the jury. What are you expecting to happen?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Wow, it is almost like a place where juries let people off on the gay panic defense is a place that is unsafe to be as a trans person.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

weird how "gay panic" is a defense allowed by the courts, but an appeal to jury nullification is not.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago
[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Do other countries not have juries?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago

Some other countries (and just a couple US states) explicitly ban the gay panic defense.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

Are other countries juries exposed to our media ecosystem (in the same way) which the US government supports and which pushes vile transphobia constantly?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'll tell em you're gay and I panickededgeworth-shrug

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

If you don't have any interest in a good faith discussion, you can just go ahead and stop replying to me please.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

good faith is being obtuse very-intelligent

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago

Good faith? I'm sorry, could you be more specific? What do you mean?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

the state, inside and outside courtrooms, to shut down hate crimes.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Well that's a very easy thing to say but I'm afraid you're going to have to be more specific.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

funny how we can defend property through a system of laws and enforcement but that's not specific enough to stop hate crimes

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Okay so you don't know then? It's ok to just say that.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

don't know what? laws that criminalize being queer should be stricken from the books and the people who do hate crimes should be punished. both of those elements are being rolled back in the US and you're being obtuse.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

laws that criminalize being queer should be stricken from the books

There are no such laws in existence in this country.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Meanwhile in reality, there is still plenty of shit on the books that will be enforced again if the conservative Supreme Court changes precedent and new laws are being passed with the ultimate goal of exterminating trans people.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

You say that like it's explicitly allowed by the state.

It is. Keeping it a valid legal defense is a policy choice. Some states banned it, they chose to. Other states have not, they decided not to. That's politics.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)

But it's not a valid legal defense. You cannot ban a lawyer from putting it forward as a legal defense.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Except you actually can, and many states have

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Show me, please

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago

You literally can, just like any number of other valid bases for objections to arguments put forward. If the judge rules it to be such a defense, it would be struck from the record and the jury instructed to disregard it, and if the lawyer keeps on it, they would be held in contempt of court. Furthermore, if it is plainly a case of such a defense and the judge lets it fly, the prosecution can claim mistrial.

Perhaps there are other ways of banning it, but that is the obvious one in the American framework.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You need to learn that whether something is explicit or not doesn't matter as much as what is happening in effect.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

But that "effect" has nothing to do with the US...

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yes, because no jury members live in the US corporate media ecosystem which pushes vile transphobia constantly with the support of the US government.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

There are no jury members outside the US? That's your position?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

smuglord

You aren't able to read a one sentence reply? Is that your position?

Or is it that you dont want to engage with the content and are just saying bullshit instead of being thoughtful?

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

You aren't able to read a one sentence reply?

Not only am I able, but I did. Anything else you'd like to fabricate about me?

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm somewhere in between "you can't read" and "you're a debate pervert". I decided to settle at "it's both".

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

Coming to the same conclusion.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Well, you sure didn't act like it based on your previous response, and you still haven't responded to the sentence meaningfully, so.., the latter then?

Do you just not want to engage with the content?

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I didn't respond meaningfully because the reply was not meaningful. It was just fabricated lies.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (2 children)

This?

Yes, because no jury members live in the US corporate media ecosystem which pushes vile transphobia constantly with the support of the US government.

This is lies?

Are you a naive or just willfully ignorant about how the US media apparatus works?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

they're a bigot pulling debate pervert shit to mask their bigotry

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Absolutely, yeah

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

That's clearly not what I was referring to. I don't engage with bad faith actors. Goodbye.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago

engages in bad faith I don't engage with bad faith actors berdly-smug

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Kay snowflake. Rather you leave than keep being hysterical about something that doesn't affect you and that you know nothing about.