this post was submitted on 30 Aug 2024
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"The SCOPE Act takes effect this Sunday, Sept. 1, and will require everyone to verify their age for social media."

So how does this work with Lemmy? Is anyone in Texas just banned, is there some sort of third party ID service lined up...for every instance, lol.

But seriously, how does Lemmy (or the fediverse as a whole) comply? Is there some way it just doesn't need to?

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[–] [email protected] 147 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Why should it affect LW or any other (non-Texan) instance? Any rogue country with populists at the head can implement any arbitrary legislation. That does not affect Lemmy instances hosted in countries with reasonable governments. If Texas wants to enforce their rules (or punish for non-compliance), it is on them to approach instance admins or block the site in their corner of the global internet.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 2 months ago (1 children)

This is a fair view. I'm not sure anyone has gotten that far, especially outside the country.

Heres an article about a similar bill in Utah, that hasn't gone into effect yet.

What's not clear from the Utah bill and others is how the states plan to enforce the new regulations.

I mean if the general consensus is that it doesn't apply, then, cool.

[–] [email protected] 84 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

I live in Texas, and can confidently tell you the people writing these laws have no fundamental concept of what the internet is or how to implement or enforce such a law for consistent adherence.

I can also tell you with confidence this law will be wielded with impunity against specific companies/sites our corrupt, petulant AG decides to go after. Fuck Ken Paxton.

As far as users in Texas, this is nothing a VPN can't fix.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 months ago (1 children)

They think it’s a big truck that you can just dump something on

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Is there a way to put a VPN on the router, so that all devices are covered?

[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 months ago (4 children)

Absolutely. Most "travel routers" have openvpn installed on them. I have one router set up with my normal internet, and another with a full time vpn'd connection. The VPN router was like $60.

They're also great to have when traveling. It connects to whatever random wifi, and all of your devices show up as a single device. You turn off the VPN to connect to your hotel's capture portal, then turn it back on and all of your devices have secure internet.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 months ago (3 children)

I can absolutely see Texas looking at it the other way. "Your website can be accessed by our citizens? On you to comply with our laws." They then spit out a bunch of criminal charges that make things rather inconvenient for some instance hosts. The US reach into international banking systems is uncomfortably long.

The real problem question is about federation. You can post to an instance from any federated instance. If an account is created in one instance and the user posts to a federated instance are both liable? You have to be able to create accounts AND post to be subject to the law. Can one instance not allow posts but host accounts for participation in other instances to skirt around the law?

[–] [email protected] 29 points 2 months ago (1 children)

That would require jurisdiction to charge them anyways. They do not have such power.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 2 months ago

jurisdiction and extradition. theyre too busy suppressing voting and melting their elderly.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 months ago (4 children)

Look where it's hosted? Sorry, but this approach has been outdated for decades. Laws apply when you address the users inside that legislation. No matter where you are, where your server is, etc.

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[–] [email protected] 73 points 2 months ago

As someone neither living nor hosting my instance in Texas I'll basically ignore it, and if it came to it I'd block the entirety of Texas if they somehow convince courts to enforce this outside of Texas.

[–] [email protected] 71 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Lemmy isn’t social media. Ignoring that though, the law actually says:

According to the Texas Office of the Attorney General, this new law will primarily “apply to digital services that provide an online platform for social interaction between users that: (1) allow users to create a public or semi-public profile to use the service, and (2) allow users to create or post content that can be viewed by other users of the service. This includes digital services such as message boards, chat rooms, video channels, or a main feed that presents users content created and posted by other users.”

Which literally applies to every single site on the entire planet that has a comment section. This law is incredibly unenforceable.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Lemmy is absolutely social media.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Nuh uh! I'm a Sovereign Netizen and I'm not driving social engagement, I'm just a traveler on the information superhighway!

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Yep. This is another dumbass politicians trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist with a solution that doesn't work.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 months ago

It's not about solving a problem, it's about exerting control.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 months ago (19 children)

Lemmy isn’t social media.

What in the heck is it then?

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[–] [email protected] 64 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (3 children)

The answer? Block Texas

Not joking. If suddenly hundreds or thousands of sites would become unavailable. It wouldn't last a week

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

doesnt that happen every time it rains in texas?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 months ago (3 children)

That didn't work with porn, so it's not a good idea for less popular websites.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Why would anyone mess with texas at this point?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 months ago

Cause it's funny

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[–] [email protected] 49 points 2 months ago (2 children)

The same way lemmy works with GPDR. Lemmy completely ignores it.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 months ago (19 children)

That's the vibe I'm getting. No problem.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (7 children)

It doesn't exactly ignore it, but in a sense GDPR doesn't apply to Lemmy.

Long story short, GDPR is made to protect private information, and EVERYTHING in Lemmy is public so there is no private information to protect. It's similar to things like pastebin or even public feed in Facebook, companies cannot be penalized for people willingly exposing their information publicly, but private information that is made public is a problem.

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[–] [email protected] 47 points 2 months ago

I'm so glad I don't live in that shithole state.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 2 months ago (2 children)

This has "DMCA notice to a Russian music site" vibes. Basically, we do nothing. They have absolutely zero authority outside of Texas. If the instance is inside Texas's borders, that's a different story, but if the instance is located outside, it has no obligation to follow Texas's law. They can't do anything. They can't block Lemmy, because it's federated. They can't sue Lemmy, because it's federated. They have zero recourse, except for slam their feet on the ground and cry like a petulant child.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (5 children)

I'm curious to why can't they do anything to Lemmy because it's federated.

Can they just block all the domain names of lemmy through ISP?

As for suing, can they just go after the server owners or the hosting service?

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[–] [email protected] 45 points 2 months ago (1 children)
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[–] [email protected] 34 points 2 months ago

So much freedom that it hurts.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 2 months ago (4 children)

If you don't operate in Texas, do you have you comply? Is the easy fix is don't have your servers be in Texas?

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 months ago (8 children)

Someone can correct me if im wrong, but, pretty sure its any social media. Similar to what happened with pornhub.

According to the Texas Office of the Attorney General, this new law will primarily “apply to digital services that provide an online platform for social interaction between users that: (1) allow users to create a public or semi-public profile to use the service, and (2) allow users to create or post content that can be viewed by other users of the service. This includes digital services such as message boards, chat rooms, video channels, or a main feed that presents users content created and posted by other users.”

[–] [email protected] 28 points 2 months ago (11 children)

I mean my question was addressing the scope of the jurisdiction Texas can have over a server in another state. It feels like the onus is on them (or the ISPs in Texas) to block that server

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 2 months ago (2 children)

I'm tired of Texas trying to expand their sphere of influence beyond their borders with shitty laws and shitty judges.

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 2 months ago

It’s called the “Fuck Texas” response to such a garbage law. And good luck enforcing it especially with federated sites.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 2 months ago

lol it doesn’t

Texass is gonna have to play whack-a-mole and do it the hard way. And I’m pretty sure the more technically inclined members of the fediverse are going to have loads of fun fucking with whatever IT measures they try to mitigate this with, because they’re certainly not going to be drawing the best and brightest minds.

Put another way: weaponized non-neurotypicals are gonna have some fun fucking with a state government that doesnt like them, because the feeling is very much mutual.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 2 months ago

Set up a redirect for all Texas IP addresses. Point to Fuck Texas.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 months ago

Texas: "I'm gonna let you finish but I'm just going to keep regressing right now."

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 months ago

I'm fine with Texas disappearing from the internet. Literally every site with a comment section now has to comply or just block Texas. One of those seems more feasible.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Texas is slowly turning into Afghanistan

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Enjoying freedumb in Texas, I bet. One of the least-free states in the country.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 months ago

Its getting more dystopian by the week. I would say day, but a lot of brains don't move that fast here.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago

welp no more lemmy for texas i guess, lmao

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (3 children)

If I ran an instance and if I knew how to do it, I'd just prevent it from working in Texas like all the porn sites are doing.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Comply?

"Is there some way it just doesn't need to" = "Is there some scenario in which Texas laws don't apply worldwide?"

Yes. There is.

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