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So is the US slipping into Civil War? (lemmy.world)

submitted 9 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

385 comments fedilink hide all child comments

People keep talking about "Federalizing the National Guard" and now you've got other States pledging their NG to Texas in defiance of the Supreme Court (see image).

So is this what CW2 looks like?

P.S. I'm a Brit

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Oh, that makes sense. You're not talking specifically about countries with federal systems of government, you're talking about countries that have any form of local government in addition to a national government. That's technically not federalism, but I see what you're talking about.

Here's what Wikipedia has to say about this:

In a federation, the division of power between federal and regional governments is usually outlined in the constitution. Almost every country allows some degree of regional self-government, but in federations the right to self-government of the component states is constitutionally entrenched. Component states often also possess their own constitutions which they may amend as they see fit, although in the event of conflict the federal constitution usually takes precedence.

According to the textbook my American Government class uses (We the People, 14th Essentials Edition by Ginsberg, Lowi, Tolbert, and Campbell), less than 15% of the world's countries use federal systems.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I was talking about both, and thinking about federations by population and influence (e.g. India, Russia, Brazil, Germany, Canada, Australia and the US) as well as regional representation which of course is not federalism per se. Thanks for citing your source, I concede to your point, but remonstrate by arguing that <15% of countries by number is not necessarily a useful statistic. I'd argue that the proportion by population, land area and political/cultural influence is a better metric (and I don't have a source for that but expect by population it'd be closer to 50:50). Fair?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I concede to your point, but remonstrate by arguing that <15% of countries by number is not necessarily a useful statistic. I’d argue that the proportion by population, land area and political/cultural influence is a better metric (and I don’t have a source for that but expect by population it’d be closer to 50:50). Fair?

No, I don't think that's fair, because 1) I was specifically referring to the relative scarcity of federal governments out of all the governments in the world, and 2) you're moving the goalpost in order to win the argument. You stated:

Your wording has a distinct bias of American exceptionalism, since your first sentence is patently incorrect - federal and unitary governments are roughly evenly represented across the world’s 200-odd governments.

In reality, your statement was patently incorrect. Federal and unitary governments are not roughly evenly represented across the world's governments. In fact, the percentage of the world's population that resides in a country with a federal system of government is only 38.05%, and that drops to 20.28% if you don't count India, a significant outlier. The total physical area of the world claimed by countries with federal systems is closer to your 50% guess, at 42.53%, but that drops to 29.89% if you don't count the Russian Federation, another significant outlier.

Your claim of roughly even representation between federal and unitary governments isn't accurate by any of the metrics you used: Number of governments, population, and land area. I'm not sure how political/cultural influence can be quantified, but I dispute its relevance.

Sources: I sourced my populations from World Meter, Wikipedia, and Census.gov, and I used Wikipedia as a source for land areas.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 months ago

All fair points, you win!