this post was submitted on 05 Sep 2023
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Schoolgirls who refused to change out of the loose-fitting robes have been sent home with a letter to parents on secularism.


French public schools have sent dozens of girls home for refusing to remove their abayas – long, loose-fitting robes worn by some Muslim women and girls – on the first day of the school year, according to Education Minister Gabriel Attal.

Defying a ban on the garment seen as a religious symbol, nearly 300 girls showed up on Monday morning wearing abayas, Attal told the BFM broadcaster on Tuesday.

Most agreed to change out of the robe, but 67 refused and were sent home, he said.

The government announced last month it was banning the abaya in schools, saying it broke the rules on secularism in education that have already seen headscarves forbidden on the grounds they constitute a display of religious affiliation.

The move gladdened the political right but the hard left argued it represented an affront to civil liberties.

The 34-year-old minister said the girls refused entry on Monday were given a letter addressed to their families saying that “secularism is not a constraint, it is a liberty”.

If they showed up at school again wearing the gown there would be a “new dialogue”.

He added that he was in favour of trialling school uniforms or a dress code amid the debate over the ban.

Uniforms have not been obligatory in French schools since 1968 but have regularly come back on the political agenda, often pushed by conservative and far-right politicians.

Attal said he would provide a timetable later this year for carrying out a trial run of uniforms with any schools that agree to participate.

“I don’t think that the school uniform is a miracle solution that solves all problems related to harassment, social inequalities or secularism,” he said.

But he added: “We must go through experiments, try things out” in order to promote debate, he said.


‘Worst consequences’

Al Jazeera’s Natacha Butler, reporting from Paris before the ban came into force said Attal deemed the abaya a religious symbol which violates French secularism.

“Since 2004, in France, religious signs and symbols have been banned in schools, including headscarves, kippas and crosses,” she said.

“Gabriel Attal, the education minister, says that no one should walk into a classroom wearing something which could suggest what their religion is.”

On Monday, President Emmanuel Macron defended the controversial measure, saying there was a “minority” in France who “hijack a religion and challenge the republic and secularism”.

He said it leads to the “worst consequences” such as the murder three years ago of teacher Samuel Paty for showing Prophet Muhammad caricatures during a civics education class.

“We cannot act as if the terrorist attack, the murder of Samuel Paty, had not happened,” he said in an interview with the YouTube channel, HugoDecrypte.

An association representing Muslims has filed a motion with the State Council, France’s highest court for complaints against state authorities, for an injunction against the ban on the abaya and the qamis, its equivalent dress for men.

The Action for the Rights of Muslims (ADM) motion is to be examined later on Tuesday.


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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (11 children)

I don't want religion in schools, outside that, you're still free to practice what you want, but keep religion out of education. France got this one right

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (2 children)

An abaya isn't religious, they're just worn in places that are usually Muslim and often worn by Muslims. This is racist discrimination.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

even if it was religious (which it partially is) muslims have a right to practice their faith. Keep religion out of education is a slogan that means don't let religious groups control the content of educational content but has been coopted in this thread to mean "don't allow children the right to practice their parents faith"

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (11 children)

It's horrible that parents get to abuse their children and we have to pretend it's normal and "just the way religion works". Schools should ban the display of one's religion. No crosses, no shirts about god, no religious clothing nothing.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (4 children)

How much of human stupidity can be boiled down to "I don't like you wearing a silly hat," I wonder.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (8 children)

Real talk if you're fine with China's anti-extremism program in Xinjiang and you're not fine with France enforcing secular clothing in its schools then you need to reflect on your double standards. While France has many instances of Islamophobia and I'm sure this policy has been implemented poorly in many places, the fact is that children should be protected from being forced into certain restrictive practices by their parents. Shit like this is why all schools should have uniforms - visible class and cultural distinctions only push the kids to segregate themselves, wiping away those distinctions at the door is an extremely valuable part of social education.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

What

Edit: these are right wing talking points coming from a hexbear user cool cool rust-darkness

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago (20 children)

Sincere question. Obviously France is racist as fuck and instituting (or enforcing, whichever) policies in a racist way. But I'm seeing a lot of people saying that these outfits being banned are not actually religious at all, and are only culturally popular within the cultures of the people being targeted. If that's the case, why are they still coming to school wearing them? If I were a kid and the government suddenly decided I'm not allowed to wear blue jeans to school, I'd wear khaki pants and then meet up with my friends and say "wtf is the deal with this new policy"

If they're just clothes and not religious garb, why are kids still wearing them to schools which don't allow them?

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

meet up with my friends and say "wtf is the deal with this new policy"

i'd wear blue jeans and say fuck these assholes, and get to go home for a day off sicko-power

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago (5 children)

All the students should start wearing abayas.

It will entirely break down the argument that it's a religious symbol.

While secularism is important for the school as an official institution, the fact that this applies to private persons is absolutely dumb.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago

least racist european country

Death to America

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 year ago

Those girls get pressured by their family and then pressured again in school/work. They have to wear it but also mustn’t…

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