this post was submitted on 05 Sep 2023
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Schoolgirls who refused to change out of the loose-fitting robes have been sent home with a letter to parents on secularism.


French public schools have sent dozens of girls home for refusing to remove their abayas – long, loose-fitting robes worn by some Muslim women and girls – on the first day of the school year, according to Education Minister Gabriel Attal.

Defying a ban on the garment seen as a religious symbol, nearly 300 girls showed up on Monday morning wearing abayas, Attal told the BFM broadcaster on Tuesday.

Most agreed to change out of the robe, but 67 refused and were sent home, he said.

The government announced last month it was banning the abaya in schools, saying it broke the rules on secularism in education that have already seen headscarves forbidden on the grounds they constitute a display of religious affiliation.

The move gladdened the political right but the hard left argued it represented an affront to civil liberties.

The 34-year-old minister said the girls refused entry on Monday were given a letter addressed to their families saying that “secularism is not a constraint, it is a liberty”.

If they showed up at school again wearing the gown there would be a “new dialogue”.

He added that he was in favour of trialling school uniforms or a dress code amid the debate over the ban.

Uniforms have not been obligatory in French schools since 1968 but have regularly come back on the political agenda, often pushed by conservative and far-right politicians.

Attal said he would provide a timetable later this year for carrying out a trial run of uniforms with any schools that agree to participate.

“I don’t think that the school uniform is a miracle solution that solves all problems related to harassment, social inequalities or secularism,” he said.

But he added: “We must go through experiments, try things out” in order to promote debate, he said.


‘Worst consequences’

Al Jazeera’s Natacha Butler, reporting from Paris before the ban came into force said Attal deemed the abaya a religious symbol which violates French secularism.

“Since 2004, in France, religious signs and symbols have been banned in schools, including headscarves, kippas and crosses,” she said.

“Gabriel Attal, the education minister, says that no one should walk into a classroom wearing something which could suggest what their religion is.”

On Monday, President Emmanuel Macron defended the controversial measure, saying there was a “minority” in France who “hijack a religion and challenge the republic and secularism”.

He said it leads to the “worst consequences” such as the murder three years ago of teacher Samuel Paty for showing Prophet Muhammad caricatures during a civics education class.

“We cannot act as if the terrorist attack, the murder of Samuel Paty, had not happened,” he said in an interview with the YouTube channel, HugoDecrypte.

An association representing Muslims has filed a motion with the State Council, France’s highest court for complaints against state authorities, for an injunction against the ban on the abaya and the qamis, its equivalent dress for men.

The Action for the Rights of Muslims (ADM) motion is to be examined later on Tuesday.


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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (6 children)

Real talk if you're fine with China's anti-extremism program in Xinjiang and you're not fine with France enforcing secular clothing in its schools then you need to reflect on your double standards. While France has many instances of Islamophobia and I'm sure this policy has been implemented poorly in many places, the fact is that children should be protected from being forced into certain restrictive practices by their parents. Shit like this is why all schools should have uniforms - visible class and cultural distinctions only push the kids to segregate themselves, wiping away those distinctions at the door is an extremely valuable part of social education.

[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 year ago

I really can’t stress enough that schools enforcing dress codes isn’t related to counter-terrorism just because the girls were Muslim

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

What

Edit: these are right wing talking points coming from a hexbear user cool cool rust-darkness

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

These are not right-wing talking points, right-wingers love Islam because it's a religion that oppresses women and openly attacks LGBT folks

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago

Yes famously pro-immigrant, especially Muslim immigrant, right wing political parties

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Web be fucked if they ever figure out that Islam is a right wing ideology but absolutely fucking not do republicans support Muslims.

The only time they've ever pretended to care about lgbtq people is when they could use it to attack Islam (while conveniently giving Christianity a pass)

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

"Religion is the opium of the people." (Karl Marx, you might have heard of him)

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

"while france has many instances of islamophobia, i'm going ignore it and make a case for why france should actually force women to dress in this or that way"

segregate themselves

It happens anyway because of the color of the skin or the accent or whatever. You make it sound like a solution when it isn't, really.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

wiping away those distinctions at the door is an extremely valuable part of social education.

no the role of education is not to erase minority cultures that is not only on the face of it terrible it's also directly and extremely counter to China's policy on ethnic minority cultures within China which is based on Stalin's policy on Russian ethnic minorities specifically that they should be enabled to practice their culture without the state getting in the way. It's much more in line with the Tsar's attitude towards ethnic minorities and russification. Stop making China look bad by attributing this terrible idea China wouldn't do to China

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I worded it poorly, but my point was that France's enforcement of a dress code is far less extreme than the cultural intervention in Xinjiang. Furthermore I think that all of the people in this thread who've compared it to Native American residential schooling are themselves engaging in genocide denial by way of minimization.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

Uniforms in school don't wipe distinctions, they make them less visible to outsiders, every kid still knows who is rich, who is poor, who is religious and who is not. Uniforms serve as a security theater, and limit considerably the freedom of every child who wears one while augmenting the parents expectations of how safe a place the school is.