this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2023
84 points (75.3% liked)
Asklemmy
43962 readers
1251 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy π
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- [email protected]: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Because the majority of Ledditors are either liberals or full blown reactionaries and the ones who are not range from some cringey techno-libertarian who think FOSS will usher in socialism to some radlib cruise-missile socialist who strangely never deviates from the US state department. The very few who could legitimately be considered socialists are some kind of anarchist. They certainly aren't Marxist.
Outside of those two, I won't hold my breath. The easiest litmus test in the world is how they're responding to the genocide at Gaza. There's very few places where you'll get complete support for the Palestinian liberation struggle and not whining about the imaginary babies Hamas allegedly beheaded or trying to equate the conduct of a genocidal nuclear power to a paramilitary fighting for national liberation.
What's your opinion on killing civilians attending a festival?
just a heads up that they cant see your comment and wont be able to respond because according to the hexbear modlog you were banned from hexbear 3 months ago for transphobia and mocking non binary hexbear users for using alternative pronouns
Ahh, what actually happened is I said they behave like alt-right, and their neo-pronouns look more like a mockery of trans people than being genuinely trans-inclusive in ways that matter in real life.
Which, I'm still open to an explanation of how they are advancing trans right irl, and taking the L and admitting I was wrong. Their response was to sexually harass me instead. I'm not mad, but if I accuse you of behaving like alt-right and you dig your heels in deeper to behave like alt-right, that's on you man.
Thank you for the heads up though.
** Edit: as a sidenote, for all the lip-service Hexbear gives trans people, they still cannot tell the difference between men and people with penises.
as a trans person reading some of the comments they cite as the reason you're banned they seem pretty transphobic, just because you preface one of them with an 'im not transphobic, but...' comment it doesnt make it not transphobic to mock people for using neopronouns
Yeah I was a complete asshole. Not an excuse, but this was after about 2-dozen people sexually harassed me, so I was not at my best. And I will apologize any time for anyone who is hurt or offended.
That said, I was also speaking to people who started out as rape apologists in the context of Russian soldiers and Ukrainians families. If you're pretty cool with kids getting raped by soldiers, but you're offended that someone didn't memorize 4 different neo-pronouns, that is 100% a place of privilege. Am I wrong on that?
Edit: also, as you are a trans person, recognizing that you are in a world where your safety is often a razor-thin line, anything I said that you felt unsafe around, I do deeply apologize.
looking at the original thread through the modlog on their side they were actually talking about food security in china and not r*pe apologia. Even if they had been saying how great SA is, the transphobia you showed in that thread entirely unprompted wouldnt have been justified because they were doing something that was also bad
Also gonna bug you again because I am so thirsty for conversation around this.
I am not trans, but from what I've seen and experienced from people close to me, especially in the midwest, living as a trans person is difficult and dangerous. There's so much work to put in to be perceived a certain way, which bathroom is it safe to use, getting medical care, getting hormones and transitioning, who is it safe to come out to.
But then you can have over here a super privileged white man, who decides he now goes by neo-pronouns, puts no work or risk in and retains every privilege in society of being a white man.
This looks to me in absolutely no way comparable to what it's like to be trans.
I would say something like, I feel like neo-pronoun people have culturally appropriated the struggle of trans people. You can pick up some neo-pronouns and get all the leftist points, without actually putting yourself on the line the way trans people put themselves on the line.
I'll take the L again and say the above is coming from a place of personal ignorance. I am an ignorant asshole. I'm very interesting in learning different and even better perspectives.
Since you're either unable or unwilling to engage in any further, I'll tell you what it looks like right now:
Any rational well-adjusted person will be pro-trans rights. Therefore it doesn't make a good enough loyalty check for a rather high-key cultish group. The neo-pronouns are the loyalty check. Neo-pronouns have nothing to do with being trans, everything to do with checking to see if someone fits into the cult.
Hexbear weaponizes accusations of transphobia the exact way Israel weaponizes accusations of antisemitism. It's nothing to do with trans people or Jewish people, and everything to do with the cult. You are either with the cult, or you're against it.
At the end of the day, Israel is bad for Jews, and will happily sacrifice the rights of Jewish people around the world, I think Hexbear is bad for trans rights, and will happily sacrifice the rights and safety of trans people anywhere in the world to achieve its own political goals. For example, Dems in the US might be trash, but they are also the only change trans people have right now. I think Hexbear would throw trans people in the US in front of a train if it meant a geopolitical win for them.
So call me whatever you want; when it comes to afab and amab people who want to be identified as a brother, a sister, or a sibling, they have always had my unwavering support. When it comes to Hexbear and the neo-pronouns, that is demonstrably the real transphobia, and trans exploitation. And I am still waiting to hear otherwise.
i literally just wasnt looking at lemmy, i didnt see your three comments until now, i wasnt like evading you or anything. i'll just like read what you said fully now
edit: having actually read it the like whole stereotype of like a privileged white person changing their pronouns for attention and so they can feel oppressed is largely a transphobic trope that gives cover for putting down trans people. to some degree i agree that like queer white people can use their queerness as a weapon against racial minorities as a putdown (i've seen this happen myself personally) and solely refer to violence against trans people without mentioning that the majority of transphobic murders and sexual assaults that happen are against black trans people so even though all trans people are under threat, black queer people are at the meeting point of queerness and blackness where violence against them is considered the most acceptable by frothing conservatives - but this is like a discussion to be had between queer and POC people, not white cishet people.
the majority of people who like use neopronouns mainly do it in queer exclusive spaces because like there's a risk of having conservatives get really mad at them over it, that's why its not really visible to cishet people outside of the internet because most cishets arent privy to the spaces where queer people do it, it's not just a thing people do to seem special (for instance Leslie Feinberg, a very well known trans liberationist activist used neopronouns "I am a human being who would rather not be addressed as Ms. or Mr., maβam or sir. I prefer to use gender-neutral pronouns like sie (pronounced like βseeββ) and hir (pronouncedlike βhereβ) to describe myself. I am a person who faces almost insurmountable difficulty when instructed to check off an βFβ or an βMβ box on identification papers.").
In regards to the "hexbear is like israel" thing, i disagree with quite a lot that they say but to compare them to a country currently doing a genocide is a bit out of hand. I disagree with their whole "Dont vote" shit but like i can understand where its coming from, in my own country (Britain) there's a sense that like the labour party is stripping away the pro queer stance that they had under corbyn while platforming transphobes and cynically using queer rights to promote the actual Israel. The conservatives would be so much worse than the labour party and are currently basically teeing themselves up to be like american republicans were a few years ago but i get the urge to just burn it all down, when it comes to the vote i'll be going to vote and cursing starmer's name while i do it, but i'll probably still be voting for him
So maybe you can help me out with this bit:
Where I'm at right now, I feel like trans inclusivity means, that regardless of being born afab or amab, if you want to be perceived and treated by he/him pronouns, she/her pronouns, or they/them pronouns, you deserve that recognition and treatment.
That is currently where I am at for trans inclusivity.
I support that, in my workplace and in my community.
Am I falling short here? Am I not reaching far enough to be trans inclusive?
Edit: SA was a different thread, it's somewhere way back there in my history.
Gonna give you my honest two cents.
You come across as a cunt whenever you police who can use neo pronouns based on how they look or act.
Pronouns are something people should be free to explore.
Hopefully being able to look into the topic without prejudice will allow people to discover their own queerness and/or empathise with people that do use them.
Neverind that that is bad faith to argue that hexbear enforces neo pronouns, trad pronouns or anonymous can be used.
Do you mean the civilians at the festival that the IDF admitted to killing on the 6th?