this post was submitted on 15 Nov 2023
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The Israeli government is straight up evil, maybe.
The Israeli people have been targets of precise statements from multiple neighbors over the years telling them they would be exterminated as soon as the opportunity arose.
Put yourself in that position and tell me you wouldn't support a right wing militant government that ran on a platform of hard borders and strong military.
How many wars of aggression have been waged against Israel since its founding? How many terrorist attacks? If the nations surrounding them put down their weapons and accepted them, there would be peace in the region. If the Israelis put down their weapons they would be murdered en masse.
How would you like a populace that came within a hair's breadth of systematic extermination to react when they move to an area and are immediately painted as liars by neighbors who are Holocaust deniers and express the desire to finish the job?
Also if your argument is strong enough there's no need to add that last part. It makes you seem weak and devalues any merit in your words, of which there is plenty. Nobody wants to see people getting hurt, but to fail to differentiate between the Israeli government and the Israeli people, and to ignore the situation they are in and the precursor to the establishment of the state of Israel, is a mistake.
They chose for religious reasons to slowly invade and genocide a people in an area that was extremely hostile to them.
Historically Jewish people have been given land in Spain and Italy to found their own nation. Both times they sold it and invaded Israel in history.
I have zero sympathy for them, because historically, they've been the invading aggressors to the region because they feel they have some sort of religious right to it, and since I'm anti-theist and believe religion is the root of all evil seeing both sides die in this conflict is kind of desirable to me.
Children get indoctrinated into Islam and Judaism and inherit this conflict and its derived suffering from their parents. As an anti-theist, you should be able to see them as victims, rather than see the conflict as something positive.
Am I a poor little victom instead of an oppressor because I didn't personally create patriarchy, white supremacy, ableism, heteronormativity? If I keep supporting those systems, at least when I'm an adult, I am an oppressor and fully responsible.
Depends. Are you 10 years old, or do you have children under your care?
How does that track?
Those kids have zero chance of growing up as anything other than the religion they're raised in under even normal circumstances.
The one good thing out of all of this, is at the end of the day there's that many less believers in the world.
You can definitely exit religion even growing up in a heavily religious environment, it seems you did in your own experience right?
I grew up in Texas surrounded by Christians, while I was lucky enough that both my parents are... Not religious per-say (but maybe deist?) I wasn't forced into religion either, I went to church many times with family and friends but never really "bought it" and eventually ended up as an atheist. My wife was Christian when we met and eventually also came over to atheism eventually after many many discussions and videos and evidence etc... people can be deconverted, it just takes a lot.
I think the Internet helped me to not fall into the trap personally, and definitely helped with getting my wife out of it.
I understand as a fellow atheist, but I would just say try to have some compassion for people as a whole, even if they believe in stupid sky daddys.
After what I went through at the hands of my ultra religious parents, at the hands of the Catholic church I went to, and finally at the hands of the conversion therapy religious camp I was imprisoned in, I can tell you right now I have absolutely zero capacity for any compassion for any believer what so ever.
If I could press a button and kill them all I'd do it in a heartbeat. No believer deserves even the tiniest iota of your sympathy or compassion. I promise you one atheist to another, they feel the same way about you.
I feel for your experiences but again want to stress that not all of them are unsaveable, many were just born into it and brainwashed throughout their lifetime and never actually given any alternative.
I used to be a very angry atheist as well, and I will definitely still debate theists and point out the idiocy in religion, but I also don't particularly blame them for being that way.
Obviously there are many examples of shit people who wield it to hurt others, as you've clearly experienced, but they're not all like that, and were not going to win any/many over by saying we want them all to die, even if I agree that the world would be better off if religion didn't exist.
A common one I see is the "how can you have morals without religion" which... Ugh but people literally often aren't ever given an opposing viewpoint in a reasonable and rational manner.
Anyway, hope you're better in life after getting away from that garbage.
It literally says it's good to kill atheists in their holy book, regardless of which abrahamic religion you choose. And while, yes, Christians, Muslims, and Jews can pick and choose what they follow, but in the case of Muslims, clearly you have to see the threat. If you don't recognize the potential, or hear how they demonize atheists, I really can't help you. You can allow yourself to be lulled into a false sense of security by some of them that pretend to be better, but I won't.
Right, I'm aware, but we should strive to be more moral then them, that includes not wishing for their death just because of their religion.
See, I can't separate the FACT that their religion calls for our death in their 'holy and perfect word from god' called the bible and they follow it still despite that. Their religion also justifies misogyny, slavery, and a myriad of completely immoral things.
Again, well aware, but the majority of religious folk in civilized countries discard those aspects. That is definitely a reason we have to fight back from them holding power or indoctrinating more children, but that still doesn't justify calling for all of them to die.
Most Palestinians are Muslim and follow the Quran, not the Bible.
The Quaran, Torah, and Bible all have passages on killing atheists.