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Europe Can’t Fund ‘Lost’ War in Ukraine Without US, Orban Says (www.bloomberg.com)

submitted 1 week ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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Europe won’t be able to finance Ukraine’s defenses against Russia’s invasion on its own if the US withdraws support under Donald Trump’s next presidency, Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban said Friday.

Orban said recent events vindicated the conclusions from his controversial July diplomatic mission to Kyiv, Moscow and Beijing and showed Ukraine was losing the war.

“The Americans are going to get out of this war,” Orban, who is hosting a European Union summit in Budapest on Friday, said on public radio. “Europe can’t finance this war on its own.”

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (19 children)

Yeah the best way to discourage a revanchist is to give him what he wants. Succeeding in Ukraine will definitely convince Putin not to attack the baltics, poland, or finland.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (11 children)

You don’t understand what Russia wants; you understand what Western propaganda tells you it wants.

Reuters, 2014: Leaked audio reveals embarrassing U.S. exchange on Ukraine, EU
Leaked recording between Nuland and Pyatt: audio | transcript
Counterpunch, 2014: US Imperialism and the Ukraine Coup
BBC, 2014: Ukraine underplays role of far right in conflict
Human Rights Watch, 2014: Ukraine: Unguided Rockets Killing Civilians
Consortium News, 2015: The Mess That Nuland Made Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland engineered Ukraine’s regime change without weighing the likely consequences.
The Hill, 2017: The reality of neo-Nazis in Ukraine is far from Kremlin propaganda
The Guardian, 2017: 'I want to bring up a warrior': Ukraine's far-right children's camp – video
George Washington Univ., 2017: NATO Expansion: What Gorbachev Heard U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents posted today by the National Security Archive at George Washington University.
WaPo, 2018: The war in Ukraine is more devastating than you know
Reuters, 2018: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem
The Nation, 2019: Neo-Nazis and the Far Right Are On the March in Ukraine
openDemocracy, 2019: Why Ukraine’s new language law will have long-term consequences
Al Jazeera, 2022: Why did Ukraine suspend 11 ‘pro-Russia’ parties?
Orinoco Tribune, 2022: Former German Chancellor Merkel Admits that Minsk Peace Agreements Were Part of Scheme for Ukraine to Buy Time to Prepare for War With Russia
Jacobin, 2022: A US-Backed, Far Right–Led Revolution in Ukraine Helped Bring Us to the Brink of War
Consortium News, 2023: The West’s Sabotage of Peace in Ukraine Former Israeli Prime Minister Bennett’s recent comments about getting his mediation efforts squashed in the early days of the war adds more to the growing pile of evidence that Western powers are intent on regime change in Russia.
NYT, 2024: U.N. Court to Rule on Whether Ukraine Committed Genocide
History of Fascism in Ukraine: Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV

INB4 NATO is a defensive alliance.

Counterpunch, 2020: The U.S. Did Not Defeat Fascism in WWII, It Discretely Internationalized It
The Intercept, 2021: Meet NATO, the Dangerous “Defensive” Alliance Trying to Run the World
CounterPunch, 2022: NATO is Not a Defensive Alliance
Noam Chomsky, 2023: NATO “most violent, aggressive alliance in the world”
Thomas Fazi, 2024: NATO: 75 years of war, unprovoked aggressions and state-sponsored terrorism

[+] [email protected] -11 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (10 children)

Just because you can cherry pick a dozen articles from the last TEN YEARS about NATO and Ukraine doesn't make you right.

I don't even need an article to refute all of that - Russia attacked a neighbor unprovoked, NATO has attacked NOBODY ever.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 days ago

Please tell me this is sarcasm. The fact that there have been so much consistent reporting over such a long period of time about NATO and Ukraine means it absolutely needs to be considered.

I don’t even need an article to refute all of that - Russia attacked a neighbor unprovoked, NATO has attacked NOBODY ever.

Again, please tell me this is satire. NATO has attacked multiple countries over the years. But also, since the advent of nuclear weapons, firing the first shot stopped being the standard. Because the first shot can now be a total annihilation shot, no country is capable of having a strategy that judges threats only by who fired the first shot. It must be judged by who is establishing the positioning to undermine security. Russia is not deploying nuclear capabilities around the world. The USA is deploying nuclear capabilities around the world, and in Europe it is doing so through NATO. This may be a shock to you, but deploying nuclear capabilities to undermine the security of another nation is NOT an act of peace.

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