this post was submitted on 29 Jun 2024
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Stay Mad, Tankies (lemmy.world)
submitted 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
 
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[–] [email protected] 58 points 6 months ago (1 children)

You sound like a rational tankie, which by the definitions that lemmies have explained to me, would make you not a tankie.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

"Anyone who thinks themselves a tankie is too self aware to be one" sounds like one of those fallacies you'd learn about in highschool. (What is a tankie, btw? I've been too scared to ask...)*

[–] [email protected] 24 points 6 months ago (2 children)

A tankie is, broadly, someone who wants to effect left-wing ideology using authoritarian methods. It originally referred to those who defended the USSR using tanks to suppress the Hungarian Revolution, but it could be aptly used to describe those who defend China's actions in Tiananmen Square. It's rightfully used as a perjorative, since authoritarian enforcement is antithetical to leftism, particularly communism.

Tankies are hypocrites who didn't understand their self-proclaimed ideologies. If someone's idea of communist praxis is lining up dissenters for the firing squad, you're dealing with a tankie.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago (2 children)

wants to effect left-wing ideology using authoritarian methods

Odd. I'm getting called a tankie because I just won't vote for Biden (or Trump). Someone must have gotten confused.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 6 months ago

By their reasoning:

No vote for Biden is a vote for Trump. Trump is fascist and authoritarian. Tankies are authoritarians. Therefore, you are a tankie. /s

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Lots of people say lots of silly things, nonetheless Trump is worse for the proletariat than Biden, and turning your nose up at the lesser evil endangers real people when the greater evil wins. You don't have to vote for the greater evil to help tip the scales in their favor. Accelerationism is authoritarianism with extra steps and no one in the driver's seat.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Biden doesn't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor. Biden's family doesn't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor. Biden's campaign doesn't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor. The DNC leadership doesn't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor. People who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries don't accept blame for tipping the scale in their favor. Moderaters and political analysts don't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor. People like you letting those people get away with that and focusing on telling me to be quiet and vote for Biden don't accept blame for tipping the scales in their favor.

I don't accept blame for it either.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

IDGAF who does or doesn't accept blame for whatever. I care about material results; my future, my family's future, my neighbors' futures, the future of the people who live in this country, and this world. IDGAF how ideologically pure a politician is, or who's wrong or right, or who gets away with whatever. I care about the people who are going to suffer if the Federalists, Fascists, and Fundamentalists keep establishing their foothold judge by judge, bill by bill, ruling by ruling.

This isn't grade school, this isn't a game, this isn't about fair. There are real stakes here. People will die. I'm not heartless enough to play the blame game with lives on the line. I'm voting harm reduction because I'm an adult and I play the hand I'm dealt. Righteously losing doesn't help anything but ego-centric deontology.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I care about material results; my future, my family’s future, my neighbors’ futures, the future of the people who live in this country, and this world.

Same bud. And Biden was never the guy who was going to do that for me. Where were you during the 2020 primaries? Where have you been ever since?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

He's actually been surprisingly effective. Your distaste doesn't negate his numerous policy accomplishments with tangible benefits.

Even disregarding that, even if he was ineffective, he's not trying to concentrate power into the hands of Federalists, Fascists, and Fundamentalists, so he is by default the superior choice to those who are. The material results that I care about, that reasonable adults care about, revolve around stopping the Federalists, Fascists, and Fundamentalists. Or are you on their side?

[–] [email protected] -1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

He’s actually been surprisingly effective

If you like him then you get him re-elected. I won't be voting for him a second time.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago

The material results that I care about, that reasonable adults care about, revolve around stopping the Federalists, Fascists, and Fundamentalists. Or are you on their side?

So the answer to that question is "Yes". Got it. I'm not surprised.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (2 children)

I'm a tankie. What tankie is supposed to mean is someone who blindly supports anything anyone does so long as they claim to be communist and wave a red flag. There's maybe a handful of edgy teens who actually fit that description, but the way it's actually used is to punch left at anyone who supports anything a socialist country has ever done, or who is insufficiently patriotic/nationalistic and is willing to consider things from an internationalist perspective.

If you say for example that Cuba under Castro had a successful literacy program, then there are people who will accuse you of being a tankie just for that. Because it gets used this way, some people like myself chose to reclaim the insult and wear it proudly.

Generally, the actual term for most "tankies" would be Marxist-Leninist. But I actually prefer tankie because it's a more general, big tent label. It's used so broadly that even anarchists can be called tankies. It's basically like "woke" where it doesn't actually have any real meaning.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Well I think there are probably a half dozen interpretations that people on Lemmy use. One I have heard repeated is that they view the Tiananmen Square event as something that China rightfully did... hence "Tankie"

[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago

The idea that that's the origin of the term is a common misconception. The actual origin was about the USSR under Kruschev sending in the military in response to a rebellion in Hungary. Some British communists supported the move, while other communists opposed it and labeled the supporters as tankies.

But regardless of the origin, it's changed to where now it's liberals using it to criticize socialists in general.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 months ago

If you say for example that Cuba under Castro had a successful literacy program, then there are people who will accuse you of being a tankie just for that.

$COUNTRY had a successful literacy program under $LEFT_GOVERMENT.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 months ago

Militant leftist, in the most basic sense.

But anti-leftists tend to co-opt the term to replace 'fascist' or 'nazi' in their discourse.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago

I am by no means an expert, but the test that was explained to me is that if you look at the famous tianamen square picture of the guy holding grocery bags facing down a line of tanks, and then proceed to side with the line of tanks, then you're a tankie.

When I say that I am not an expert, what I actually mean is that I'm a random idiot from the internet, so don't take anything I say as gospel truth.

I've only been on lemmy for a few months, and I've never heard the term tankie on any other platform. My understanding is that a tankie is a militant supporter of communism, who completely disregards (or is in support of) how every time it's ever actually been done it turns into an authoritarian dictatorship (or something similarly unpleasant to live under).

My own biases exposed: I am an american, and most of what I know I learned in the absolutely fucked american public education system, which says communism = evil, because of the red scare a while back.

If you do some googling, there's a wikipedia article on the subject. I've forgotten most of the content of that article shortly after I read it, I should look at it again and maybe it will stick this time.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago

People that are happy to run people over in tanks to force their communist version of society on everyone else.