Staines

Imagine the outcry if this had happened in a real democracy, like Venezuela.

These weapons are the kind of thing the Ukrainians have developed to "retaliate" against random civilian housing blocks whenever Russia craters a command center. They're basically modern V1/V2 rockets "This will terrify the russian population into submission!!"

^ yep

You're likely getting that response because Hexbear has developed it's own culture of having earnest conversations that are intended to enrich and inform the users taking part in the discussion.

The derisive, dismissive responses are a reaction to someone breaking that etiquette by grandstanding, accusing people of logical fallacies, or resorting to insults: these are things that indicate that the person isn't sincerely interested in trying to understand the person they are speaking to.

That's the second person from hexbear that you didn't realise at the time of posting. You're going to have to get better at spotting us if we're so awful.

I'm sure Russia had to hold, (at gunpoint?) the people of Donbas who had been shelled for 8 years by the Ukrainian government to get them to vote to leave Ukraine. Or the people of Crimea who had already voted to leave Ukraine before the Russian Federation even existed.

Ah yes, "free" as opposed to »free« Ukrainian elections.

In free, western Ukrainian elections, the ruling party simply bans opposition parties that they don't approve of and seizes their assets.

You acknowledge that people have a right to defend themselves, and be supplied weapons to that effect. Your usage of "propped up" also suggests you acknowledge that there were legitimate separatist sentiments in Ukraine in 2014. Why do your principles of armed self determination break down when applied to Donbas? Seems that "tankie" is your word for "someone that believes in self determination".

When did that happen tankie?

Minsk 2, proposed by Russia, outlines that control of the border should be restored to Ukraine, and that Donbas should be reintegrated democratically back into Ukraine with a level of federalization to protect it from future lapses in Ukrainian democracy.

Interesting how dronies keep saying that the east is forcing Donbas to keep fighting. But when Russia suggests they give some land to Ukraine to stop the war, Donbas gets offended and want to keep fighting.