this post was submitted on 29 Oct 2024
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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago) (1 children)

Gaza is hardly even an issue on the ballot, you're picking between slow genocide and fast genocide.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 46 minutes ago (1 children)

Slow genocide is better though. We all get that right?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 33 minutes ago (1 children)

Certainly gives us more time to try to do something about it, yeah.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 minutes ago

99 more years at the current rate.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 49 minutes ago (1 children)

The problem of the US is that you might lose more voters by dumping Israel than you'd gain by supporting Palestine.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 40 minutes ago (1 children)

Is there actual polling to that effect?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 15 minutes ago

There are some polls that show roughly 35 to 60 percent of US voters backing the sale of arms to Israel, depending on demographics, but there is a very clear divide between Republican and Democrat support so it's disingenuous to say a candidate will lose more support than they gain because that depends on which candidate.

A lot of these polls also use loaded questions like "who is responsible for this conflict" with the two choices being Hamas and Israel, which doesn't really capture any of the nuance of the situation or represent the beliefs of the person answering the question.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

Bernie is such a good guy. The Dems have done him dirty so many times, they are currently continuing to support many harmful policies but he understands what's at stake and he puts all of that aside to do the best he can.

He doesn't have to do this. He's 83 years old and while his cognitive health is outstanding for his age, someone his age doesn't need to be on this grind for us. He probably won't stop until he's forced to due to his health. I love the guy and it's a shame we weren't given the chance to see him take the presidency.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 8 hours ago

That's a bad headline. Watch his video, he makes a much more nuanced argument.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago) (1 children)

The fantasy world the zero-tolerance high-ground morality angels live in is as dangerous as the one MAGA lives in, and ironically has the same victims. They proudly polish their halos nice and shiny while they let the world burn.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 hours ago (6 children)

Don't support genocide, it's as simple as that!

By the way: Voting isn't actually support. The American system is not set up in a way where votes actually add to the power of the Presidential office. On the other hand, making a deliberate choice not to act does mean supporting whatever happens without your action, which could be genocide. This means YOU HAVE TO VOTE HARRIS IN ORDER TO NOT SUPPORT GENOCIDE. The socialism angels are hypocrites.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago) (29 children)

there are two facts about this election

  1. there are only two outcomes—0.0% chance for a third party win
  2. both candidates have a bad stance on the genocide

so neither outcome will help with the genocide. acting like voting third party helps in any way shape or form is disingenuous at best. so what should you do?

my argument is that you should vote for the person you can hope to convince on this issue. phone calls, protests, social media, whatever means you have... which of these candidates is more likely to respond to any kind of public pressure about this?

Harris might be responsive, and let's be honest, she might not be. but you know for a fact that it's definitely not the fucking orange turd. Natenyahu wants him to win. how can you ignore that?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 hours ago

What they think their vote contributes to:

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 7 hours ago

First of all, at this point people in the US should vote against Trump for their safety, and that means in the current political system they have to vote for Harris. That's the reality they have to face. The Trump party has made fascist announcements that are real and people should expect them to be made into real actions.

The problem is that the Democrats frankly have abysmal messaging and are drifting to the right further and further while using Trump as a threat to their voters. They adopt anti-immigrant policies and are distancing themselves from pro-LGBT stances, saying it's the states decision. Both these issues as well as demands for a ceasefire poll exceptionally well, but the Harris campaign seemingly don't want the edge. With all this they are signaling that right wing worries about immigrants and trans people are valid, although that's absolutely not the case, and leave people to decide for example "do I want anti-immigrant light or extra harsh anti-immigrant?" when everybody says immigrants are an issue. This is unacceptably stupid and risking the vote. And that's ignoring the elephant in the room that progressive policy like health care is exceptionally popular and using that as counter messaging would win her voters.

We've seen how popular the Democrats got after Harris took over and Walz got nominated. It signaled change. Now all the Democrats say that it's gonna be the same old as usual treading on and the same bad argument vote us or you'll get a dictatorship. I'm not denying Biden dropping out had nothing to do with the surge of popularity, but back then we also had comments like here, basically declaring any dissent from supporting a decrepit old man as the candidate as heresy. Now there are again, only Yes men here saying if you criticize Harris you're a bot or a Trump ass eater. What is wrong with you?

Finally, I have the creeping suspicion that Democratic establishment people don't fear a fascist Trump administration themselves personally as much as the population has to. Trump announces he will go after his enemies, Latinos and trans people (probably all queer people actually). He has anti women's health and rights messaging all over his campaign. But that doesn't seem to be a risk for people higher up in the party. I suspect that when you're rich you don't have to worry about abortion bans or HRT access. And if Trump threatens them with violence they always have money they can throw at him. It's much more comfortable to run a risky neo liberal and right wing platform against a fascist if you can jump ship later on.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Your vote only actually matters if you're in a wing state. If you aren't you should be voting PSL or greens.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

vote blue to start turning the state into a swing state. Definitely don't vote green as they are on the record of trying to make trump win

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

How will voting for the Dems make New York into a swing state?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 37 minutes ago

Not doing it might

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