this post was submitted on 04 Aug 2024
73 points (97.4% liked)

Fuck Cars

9626 readers
514 users here now

A place to discuss problems of car centric infrastructure or how it hurts us all. Let's explore the bad world of Cars!

Rules

1. Be CivilYou may not agree on ideas, but please do not be needlessly rude or insulting to other people in this community.

2. No hate speechDon't discriminate or disparage people on the basis of sex, gender, race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, or sexuality.

3. Don't harass peopleDon't follow people you disagree with into multiple threads or into PMs to insult, disparage, or otherwise attack them. And certainly don't doxx any non-public figures.

4. Stay on topicThis community is about cars, their externalities in society, car-dependency, and solutions to these.

5. No repostsDo not repost content that has already been posted in this community.

Moderator discretion will be used to judge reports with regard to the above rules.

Posting Guidelines

In the absence of a flair system on lemmy yet, let’s try to make it easier to scan through posts by type in here by using tags:

Recommended communities:

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

You seem to be unaware of induced demand...

[–] [email protected] -2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

You mean supply and demand? Very aware of it. But induced demand in reference to roads only shows the idea of road expansion and more people take the road. What about alleviating congestion in another part of the city due to road expansion? What about travel time? What about travel distance?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Very little of the demand is demand to drive a car. It's mostly demand to travel as effectively as possible.

When you build out road networks you make traveling by car more effective, increasing demand on that specific mode.

When you build out transit networks you make traveling by transit more effective, increasing demand on that specific mode.

When you have well designed cities, you reduce the demand for travel, period.

Higher population centers have favorable economics for transit vs. Personal vehicles. And are more impacted by pollutants.

Low population centers have favorable economics for personal vehicles vs. Transit. And are less impacted by pollutants.

That's a description of the dynamics anyway.

I imagine vast majority of people would agree that folks that live in the densist cities need transit, and those living in a forest need a personal vehicle. The debate occurs somewhere in between of the extremes.

Personally I'm of the opinion that we skew too far towards cars, because the true costs/externalities are harder to see, so what seems like favorable economics is actually just socializing the costs.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

If you don't mind, I'd like to take some time to do my own research and get back to you. Is that ok?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

For sure, happy to open up the conversation again later

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 months ago

Hey still working in time to read all the things. I haven't forgotten about you. I got a busy life