this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2023
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Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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Hey Linux devs - Build a GUI or gtfo (lemmy.ml)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
14 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

Not everything actually requires a GUI, obviously. But anything that requires configuration, especially for controlling a hardware device, should have a fully functional GUI. I know Linux is all about being in control, and users should not be afraid to use the command line, but if you have to learn another bespoke command syntax and the location and structure of the related configuration files just to get something basic to work then the developer has frankly half arsed it. Developers need to provide GUI's so that their software can be used by as many people as possible. GUI's use a common language that everyone understands (is something on or off, what numeric values are allowed, what do the options mean).

Every 12 to 18 months I make an effort to switch to Linux. Right now I'm using Archlinux, and it has been a successful trip so far, except my audio is screwed, I can't use my capture card at all, I had issues with my dual displays at the start, and the is no easy way to configure my AMD graphics card for over clocking or well anything basic at all.

I'm not looking for a windows clone, I love that I can choose different desktop environments and theme many of them to death. I even like the fact there are so many distros. Choice is a big part of linux, but there is clearly a desire to get more people moving away from Windows and until that path is 95% seamless most people just won't. Right now I think Linux is 75% to 85% seamless depending on the use case and distro but adding more GUI front ends would, imho, push that well into the 90% zone.

GUI is not a dirty word, it is what makes using a new OS possible for more people.

EDIT: Good conversation all. This is genuinely not intended to be a troll post, I just feel it is good to share experiences especially on the frustations that arise from move between OSes.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I guess you're not an opensource developer. Let me put it in terms that you understand:

Let's say you're a pizza delivery dude. You have to be out every day, delivering people to rude customers, no matter the weather. It's hot and your balls are sweating off, if cold and your fingers are freezing, there torrential rain and you get soaked for every delivery, but bossman don't care - you have to do it!

To relax, you have a hobby as a wood worker. It's your passion! You make small things to make life a little easier or things that look cool to you.
One day, you buy a cupboard that's been all the rage. Every store out there has it and it's flying off the shelves. But after a few months there's something annoying about the way it works. Not a problem for you, the handyman, the woodworker. It takes a few weeks, but you've designed, built, and tested a few solutions to arrive at something that works. It's not beautiful, it's not trendy, sexy or anything, it just works.

Thinking to yourself "hey somebody else might find this useful", you put the designs online. To your delight, there are a few people using it. Very few "thank you"s, but that's fine, at least it helped somebody.

Then one day, some dude writes a comment about your solution titled "Build something beautiful or GTFO".

Tell me, how would that make you, as the hobby wood worker feel?

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago

I get it. I'm not a pro developer but I code quite regularly. I realise all the support you need to give for anything you develop, the time and effort involved. And frontends often take more time build than the thing it presents. My point is, there are basic gaps that need should have been addressed by now. the KDE and gnome devs could focus on those items rather than the next impressive theming function.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

The guy is really demanding something from volunteers devs? Not everyone is thinking "We need to make something easy to use so people can migrate from Windows to Linux", people just build stuff to use and share it so maybe someone could find it useful.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

You can always create a GUI yourself, if you think it's so simple. It would be greatly appreciated and giving back to the community would be nice.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Linux ist mostly used for servers, where you rarely need/have a graphical environment. A big part of development is making sure to keep the kernel safe and prevent endangering critical infrastructure.

That said, I agree if Linux is to be adopted more widely as a desktop system, good graphical UI is crucial. It's just not the focus of most Linux devs.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Hey Linux devs - Build a GUI or gtfo

No you can GTFO if that is your attitude towards people volunteering their time to bring you an open OS and all the tools you need for free.

Yes, there is still a lot of room for improvement but attacking devs for not providing a GUI is not a good way to interact with the community. If you really want to see improvements then you need to help make those improvements with constructive discussions not hostile statements. We owe you nothing.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (3 children)

My title was intentionally flipant. But I thin the automatic assumption that command line is always fine for linux desktop needs to evolve. Not to say it hasn't, but there are definitely some basic gaps.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Not evolving is a feature. I started using linux in the 90s, and you know what? About 90% of the stuff I learned then is still completely relevant.

I hate GUI apps for most things, because you have to search to figure out how to do anything. With CLI apps you read the man page and you know how to use it.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

My title was intentionally flipant.

No, your title was rude and condescending. "Flippant" is a different thing.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago

Flippantly insulating the Linux devs is not the way to improve things. It has evolved and continues to do so. There are far more GUI tools for managing things then there has ever been. The only thing you have mentioned in your post is AMD GPU overclocking - not something I would consider a novice task nor something most people are going to want to do. So the priority to get a GUI to do this is quite low. Hell, it looks like there are no userland tools at all - only raw kernel interfaces. So it is really something we are lacking any tooling at all - let along GUI tools.

Better to advocate for these tools than insult devs for not having yet created them.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Feel free to open a pr.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I used to wish for GUIs, but at some point all the textual config clicked and I am now actively avoiding GUI. It's only intuitive for simple toggles and is usually a lot more limited with complex config requirements.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

The bonus you get with GUI's is you can be reasonably sure you are doing it right, rather than having to double check syntax or which copy of the 4 different conf files you have used.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago

It's like europe with no signs in English. You're not wanted there